[Team Needed]Operation: Zero - Thread of Fate

[Hammerit]

Brand Name: Operation: Zero
Episode- Title: Thread of Fate
Full Game Title: Operation: Zero - Thread of Fate
Project Focus: Content Authenticity + Integrity, Gameplay
Development State: Pre- Alpha (Redesign taking place atm)
Type: Closed Source (commercial later on)
Market Focus: Western Europe, Northamerica
Release Date: "When it's done"
Genre: XGenre SciFi Simulation
Mode: Singleplayer, Multiplayer
Story: Multilinear (finite, conclusive), Frameworkstory offering 5 playable and 1 non-playable Chapters

Team Name: Against the Wave Game Development Studios (short: AtW Studios)
Experience Level: Experienced / Semi professional
Location: Germany
Communication OnSite, Wiki, Dev-Forum, IRC, ICQ, TS
Language(s) english (main), german (secondary)

Open Positions (freelance work, unpaid atm):

Design Department:
Quest Designer - 1
Content Designer - 1
Web Designer - 1

Programming Department:
Engine Programmer - 2
Tool Programmer - 1
Network Programmer - 1

Art Department:
3D Artist - 5
Texture Artist - 5
Concept Artist - 4
Sound / BGM Artist - 2

Technical Specifications

Platform: Windows PC (Linux support planned)
Engine: Irrlicht- based (not decided yet)
Graphic Device: DirectX 9/10, OpenGL
Programming Language: C++
Scripting Language: LUA / Python (not decided yet)
Controls: Keyboard, Mouse, Joystick

Information:

Operation: Zero tells the story of our universe from it's accidential start to it's eventual end. Out of the Framework Story covering the universe's entire life span, a certain time period of interstellar history has been split into 5 chapters, telling the story of an uncertain terrans life and how it is being influenced by the whirl of interstellar politics and diplomacy.

Operation: Zero allows the player to play as he wishes. While playing the players actions themselves determine what he can and can't do. The opportunities are endless as the player can fit the role of either a smuggler, a trader, a pirate, a policemen, a terrorist, a military, a mercenary, a bounty hunter, a headhunter, a cultist, a spy, a double agent, or just play the role of an ordinary freelancer. Each of those types of playing comes along with an entirely unique perspective on the story, it's turns and background happenings making the ingame situations the player encounters both realistic and thrilling.

In Operation: Zero the player can only fly one ship at a time, but however is able to command multiple ships in combats or for much more profitable high-scale trading. Being dynamic the enormous and authentic ingame atmosphere can be altered by the player in several ways and by several actions. The player will soon learn that he is the one made responsible for his very actions and how badly some situations can turn out on the long run if wrong decisions are made at a decisive time.

With it's tactical and economical depth Operation: Zero provides a complex challenge to those willing to invest the time. In times of war successful pilots will quickly rise in ranks and gain more and more influence in their fraction offering them a whole new playing experience each time their performance gets them promoted. Another option is to simply found an own fraction and live a free live, at least until it messes with others interests.

If the Player doesn't take action everything he knows, everyone he loves and all things he accomplished on his way are going to an end. He is the scissor to cut the thread of fate, the universe's last hope.

The future is unknown and the path concealed as the hatred of aeons awakes ... Day Zero approaches ... the final day ... the "Call of Fate".

More Information:

As in most space shooters the player commands a single ship by making use of either cockpit, 3rd, or turret view. Using it he can fight against other spacecrafts, pickup and trade wares, mine for ressources in several different locations, communicate with other ships or just wait for something to happen around him. By docking to stations and/or planet he can either check for missions, buy or sell equipement or wares, recruit an npc escort, change ships and or talk to people. Unlike most Space Shooters Operation: Zero offers a phrase-based dialogue interface which is used in every type of communication (meaning you pick a phrase and the npc answers), even when it comes to unlocking special missions. While the player can always control only one ship at a time he can use a quick command interface to make all ships in communication-range, that in whichever way belong to him (external recruits, wing members, subordinates, etc.) follow his orders.

Unlike usual Space Shooters Operation: Zero doesn't force the player into a certain role, but offers a wide range of opportunities for the player to interact with the ingame universe and make the choices himself. As the game evaluates the key actions of the player it alters the univserse according to what he did so that every action which would have consequences in Real Life actually has some.

Additionally to fighting the game offers an economic simulation interacting with the ingame universe. Economy is part of life and if it encounters bad times it will have it's influence on gameplay. One example for the massive importance of the ingame economy are the wars happening as part of the storyline: With every month and every ship lost the militarys hunger for goods grows resulting in more and more wares to never appear in the stocks. Another important role in the downfall of an economy during war plays the destruction of facilities lowering the ammount of wares produced and ressources consumed. All of this results in exploding prices and the black market to become more and more important.

Another feature enhancing the games atmosphere is the technological evolution. All races except a few start with a very limited understanding of technologies, but as time goes by each of those manages to master more and more complex systems until finally in the last years of the story all have attained the same state. But not just the technologies evolve, even the races themselves change their attitudes over time.

Project Plan:

Pre Alpha State (current)

Alpha #1
Combat system prototype
mercantile system prototype
Interaction system prototype
Script System prototype
Tactical combat system prototype
Alpha Demo

Alpha #2
Scriptbased Event Generator prototype
Action Evalutator Prototype
EcoSim Prototype
PoliSim Prototype
REGSim Prototype
Alpha Demo 2

Beta #1
Netplay Prototype
Finalization of the Script Interpreter Engine
Finalization of the 3 Simulators
CCI Prototype
Combat System Finalization
Beta Demo 1

Beta #2
CCI Finalization
Netplay Finalization
Beta Demo 2

Beta #3
Finalization of the Game Engine
Finalization of Graphics Interfaces
Enhancement of Useability
Beta Demo 3

PreRelease
Functionality Testing and Quality Assurance until the Game runs stable on all platforms

-> Goldmaster V1.0

For more detailed information contact me via PM or ICQ (preferred). Applications with concrete examples of your work showcasing your level of experience shall be provided by Email (prior contact required).

[Hammerit]

Do you guys even have anything to build off of? Because right now, it looks like you're the only one in the team, and this thread looks like the usual "here I have ideaz, need much people on team to make game, we sell game and I get 75% of moneyz, kthxbi".

It pretty much depends on what basis you're referring to. If you mean a game concept, then yes, if you mean a low level game design documentation, then it's yes again. If you however think of a high level design documentation together with a complete content database containing all the data, the answer is no, not yet as me and Liam (2nd Game Designer) are still working on it. There are several other external team members as well who participate more or less frequently. So actually yes there is something to build off of, although I'm not quite sure if it's what you meant.

The games basic story as well as a huge load of the content, which will later appear in the game has been designed allready. However as the quite big listing of open positions might tell we still lack people capable of visualizing this content and setting up the engine for us. I'm quite experienced in programming myself but with all the design work for the project haven't got the time to work into becoming a more or less specialized engine programmer.

I mean... what serious game company would re-state the title of the game in 4 different ways in 4 different lines?

Actually we are no game company yet, as being a company not just means to have a concrete project and a team willing and able to produce a game out of it. First of all it requires a quite impressive ammount of money from an external investor. And as investors don't happen to fall out of the skies these days any team searching one must first provide something showcasing that the project is worth the money spent and has the resources needed to complete the development process in a timely fashion.

To the title: Well sorry the project name was outdated, didn't check that part before posting so thanks for the telling me that it was still there. The seperation of brand name and episode (or game title) is important however to state that Operation: Zero is not the name of the game itself but the name of the brand as may be follow up projects planned for the future bearing the same brand name, but an entirely different title. The same brand name indicates that two games somehow belong to each other.

[rogerborg]

I've re-read your pitch (after 5 edits) and still have no idea what sort of game it is that you're pitching. I suspect that it may be Elite meets EVE Online, but I can't be sure. Either way, without a clear concept of what the player(s) would actually do from one moment to the next, it's hard to get excited about it.

I did spot something rather... idiosyncratic:

how badly some situations can turn out on the long run if wrong decisions are made at a decisive time.

Gimping players because they failed to read your mind and guessed wrong at a decision point early in their career is a concept that most games have left behind. For example, all successful modern MMOs have characters and storylines that are impossible to gimp accidentally. While this also means that all characters end up equal and playing much the same, and reduces the endgame to a competition over grinding to get rare loot, it does reduces frustration amongst first time players - and every player is a "first time player".

Question: did you already know that? Had you thought through the consequences of that sentence, and deliberately decided to gimp first time players if they guessed wrong? The thing is, I find it worrying if you had, and worrying if you hadn't.

[Hammerit]

I've re-read your pitch (after 5 edits) and still have no idea what sort of game it is that you're pitching. I suspect that it may be Elite meets EVE Online, but I can't be sure. Either way, without a clear concept of what the player(s) would actually do from one moment to the next, it's hard to get excited about it.

Well not much like. I've added some more Information regarding gameplay and some additional features. I hope this helps you a bit to unterstand what O:Z-ToF is all about. It's quite hard to state what a game is about without having someone sign a NDA I must admit .

did spot something rather... idiosyncratic:

how badly some situations can turn out on the long run if wrong decisions are made at a decisive time.

Gimping players because they failed to read your mind and guessed wrong at a decision point early in their career is a concept that most games have left behind. For example, all successful modern MMOs have characters and storylines that are impossible to gimp accidentally. While this also means that all characters end up equal and playing much the same, and reduces the endgame to a competition over grinding to get rare loot, it does reduces frustration amongst first time players - and every player is a "first time player".

Question: did you already know that? Had you thought through the consequences of that sentence, and deliberately decided to gimp first time players if they guessed wrong? The thing is, I find it worrying if you had, and worrying if you hadn't.

Well it's quite hard to actually gimp things, but the player can indeed mess things up and afterwards has to take consequences the one or the other way. Which decision is wrong at what time pretty much depends on the certain situation the player has encountered and how much his turn suited the normal way a normal person of normal intelligence and moral integrity would handle it. Maybe a little example can help here: For example the player climbed the career ladder of a fraction and being on the 2nd highest position betrays them although he collected quite an impressive reputation with this fraction won't be given a chance of ever joining that fraction again. This is no abstract design descision, but the only way a real fraction would handle such a situation. Depending on how much damage his "wrong" action caused the consequences get more and more threatening. At a certain point the fraction may decide to pay bountyhunters for hunting you down, or in the worst case all partners of the fraction will ally against the player. The worst cases however can occur if the player switches sides during war (not just meaning the interstellar wars taking place during the story, but even the smaller ones between fraction groups or even between fractions). In other situations there is no absolute way assumed so you can't do anything wrong, but that doesn't mean that these actions can't cause some nasty future situation. Besides almost any wrong decision is right from another perspective.

[rogerborg]

Thanks for the followup. What you've added looks to me exactly like Elite meets EVE online, but I won't push the point.

I have a suggestion that I hope comes across constructively, because I really do wish you success. If you are serious about completing this project, then why not invest several months up front to complete the game design documentation, and then solicit people to join the project?

Right now you're asking 23 people to join your project - at a collective 'cost' to themselves of at least a million dollars a year - but are pitching a vague and incomplete concept. Never mind what it says about the game: it makes it look as though you're not particularly committed to it yourself, which means that you're unlikely to attract highly skilled people who are prepared to work for free on your commercial project.

Please don't take this wrong, but this forum is absolutely littered with the corpses of abandoned projects announced by Big Ideas people who turned out to be all hat and no cattle, and I'd like to see one actually succeed for a change. 23 people is a huge team for a volunteer project, and success or failure will absolutely depend on your abilities and determination.

So... which is more likely to show people that you're a capable and committed project lead? Saying that all the information will be produced soon, or having it available?

Best of luck.

[agi_shi]

Do you guys even have anything to build off of? Because right now, it looks like you're the only one in the team, and this thread looks like the usual "here I have ideaz, need much people on team to make game, we sell game and I get 75% of moneyz, kthxbi".

It pretty much depends on what basis you're referring to. If you mean a game concept, then yes, if you mean a low level game design documentation, then it's yes again. If you however think of a high level design documentation together with a complete content database containing all the data, the answer is no, not yet as me and Liam (2nd Game Designer) are still working on it. There are several other external team members as well who participate more or less frequently. So actually yes there is something to build off of, although I'm not quite sure if it's what you meant.

Still sounds rather far fetched. Like the other poster said, you're looking for 20+ people to work "with". Have you any previous experience with games? Having previous experience would surely attract more people. Because like I said, two people having an idea is not enough to create a huge full-blown commercial game with 20+ people on it.

@ hybrid: delete my post if you wish, I don't care. I only speak of the truth, and you can clearly see that.

[Hammerit]

I have a suggestion that I hope comes across constructively, because I really do wish you success. If you are serious about completing this project, then why not invest several months up front to complete the game design documentation, and then solicit people to join the project?

Well I understand your point. But it's not like we're stopping to drive the content and documentation work forward just because we're allready seeking members. We're still at it, the project's running and sooner or later the documentations needed to actually start the high level development will have been completed. The real problem is: After those documentations we would start the in-depth mechanics documentation as well as the high level content design, things that require either programmers, or artists and sometimes even both. If at that time none of those actually is there or at least in contact range there'll be a downtime until we finally find some up for it. I personally prefer to have some people in readiness at a chance to avoid downtimes. However if noone declares willingness to participate we would still end up waiting, but at least we tried not to.

[rogerborg]

Fair enough. You've clearly thought it through and know what you're doing, so I won't bang on about it. Particularly if hybrid is enforcing mandatory happiness at the moment.

I look forward to reading exciting, compelling updates on this project.

[dlangdev]

i found this book at powell's yesterday...



...it was on sale, and the illustrations look good enough for ten bucks.

so i decided to commit reading the book and learn more.

http://www.amazon.com/Art-Game-Worlds-D ... 0060724307

i also found this link just a moment ago...yummy tasty bits of information.

http://www.vancouver.wsu.edu/fac/peabod ... rpage.html

about your project, can you add me too, i'd like to join.

but first, i need documentation. i will only move if there's documentation.

documentation means you have labored the hours and show strong commitment to your vision. so far, you look hardly serious, so prove it you're serious.

[hybrid]

I don't enforce happiness, I just pointed agi_shi to the new rules. They say that a "help wanted" post need not present screen shots or videos, just more information than the usual "we start and need help".
This post perfectly matches these rules (on the positive side), so there's no reason to start this all over. I informed agi_shi about this fact.
Maybe someone could explain me how the planning phase for a project should be handled in this forum, if not alone by the group (or person) already involved in it. Any announcement of more than just a vague question concerning game play would immediately call dozens of negative and mainly less constructive replies saying that no one will ever succeed in doing so. Except if anybody already bought shares of this particular game studio there is no real reason in keeping them from trying it. We got the new rules to allow new projects to evolve in the public. There's no good reason to hide projects until they have matured into a beta phase. After all this is open source. But since obviously no one seems to really care about his fact I'll simply wait and see how the next few project announcements will do. Maybe it's better to bash all possible projects immediately dead, you never know what would happen if someone really would find a team and make something nice and useful

[Hammerit]

Well hybrid concerning all the years of acticity in the modding and game development scene I've lived through I got used to the odd fact that somehow more people would question the concept of founding projects itself rather actually dropping lines of constructive criticism. I really don't care for why or how people bash me, my ideas, my concepts and finally my projects as long as they don't tend to attack my work directly; I mean I could complain hours and hours with the guys and exchange some words that more or less let the thread become an object to child protection. Or I could just continue on, be productive and wait for the few really helpful replies. Well although the first can be quite entertaining I prefer the latter. Having said that I would like to thank rogerborg for his constructive criticism as his comments were really helpful indeed.

[rogerborg]

Maybe someone could explain me how the planning phase for a project should be handled in this forum, if not alone by the group (or person) already involved in it.

Oh, it's perfectly valid to make an announcement of a project at this stage. I just personally feel that it's unlikely to attract a high calibre of contributor, and a project this ambitious will require that.

Any announcement of more than just a vague question concerning game play would immediately call dozens of negative and mainly less constructive replies saying that no one will ever succeed in doing so.

And did anyone say that in this thread?

There's no good reason to hide projects until they have matured into a beta phase.

Again, I don't see the relevant to this thread. Who said anything about "beta"?

Documentation - requirements, analysis, design - can and should be done pre-alpha. It's the tedious, boring part of the project that nobody really wants to do, but which I consider vital for keeping a project of this size on track. I use it as the yardstick for whether a project lead is serious about their project or not.

But since obviously no one seems to really care about his fact I'll simply wait and see how the next few project announcements will do.

I care passionately. Our disagreement seems to be over whether projects tend to die stillborn because of premature announcement, or because of negative reaction to (what I class as) premature announcement. I respect your right to be wrong on this.

Maybe it's better to bash all possible projects immediately dead, you never know what would happen if someone really would find a team and make something nice and useful

First, a project of this scope can only succeed if the lead is capable of rising above some "bashing" by anonymous intartubes nerds. If he can't, then better to find that out early. I honestly believe this.

Second, I wish someone would complete a big, quality project using Irrlicht, and I'm sure that it will happen, once a really compelling project appears.

On topic, I actually like the look of this project. It seems to me that Hammerit has put a lot of thought into this, and that he does know what he's doing. You'll notice that I've said nothing about it being over-ambitious or unachievable. What I'm suggesting is that the more of his work and knowledge is made manifest, the more likely that valuable contributors are to jump onboard and make it happen. I want to see that happen as much as you do.

[dlangdev]

all this would have been resolved and these useless comments never written if we only had this sub-group titled....

"divine inspiration"

fits perfectly like a glove.

doesn't it?

it's now time to drink my eggnog...

please excuse me, as this ceremony will require extreme pleasantries.

biscuits will be served after sipping the eggnog.

[hybrid]

rogerborg, read the quotes from agi_shi's original post. There was not much more about it, and I'd rate it "the usual non-constructive bashing".
The problem with (purely) negative reaction is that the announcers are usually not bound to Irrlicht. They have a project plan and propose it to communities. Guess which engine will make it (in the case where more than one will provide the necessary features): The one you'll have to fight for your project, or the one where it's accepted even if there's only little chance to make a bug commercial success from it.
Honestly, I don't know why projects fail. I guess that many Irrlicht based projects simply are discontinued due to personal reasons of the (usually only one or two) developers active in that project. I'd think that only commercial projects with firm deadlines can die due to premature announcement (or they become a legend, like DukeNukem Forever ). But an instantaneous and exclusive bashing without any kind of suggestions or even support has IMHO good chances to repel people. And projects that succeed with other engines should be counted as dropped projects. Moreover, premature announcement cannot be avoided by the community, dumb replies can.

[Dorth]

Humor me and read this:
http://www.sloperama.com/advice/idea.htm
The whole of it. ALL CHAPTERS!
For someone who wants to be a game designer, this should be as natural as for a coder like me, to read on latest coding tricks, all the pitfalls to avoid, etc., an investor to read on the market.
Read it, that's all I'm asking you. No need to comment on it, there'll be no test, I'm not even asking you to change anything, just read the whole thing and that should be good in itself for you, if not vital.

As an added bonus, here's a word of wisdom from it I say to you:
It doesn't matter wheither your project gets done. It probably won't. Not the first, not the second. Even if it is, it will probably not have a big success. But no matter, because after, you'll be somewhere special, somewhere new. You'll be IN the industry. From there, growing and moving up is inevitable for competent people. And then, maybe in a year, maybe in five or ten, you'll do a big game, maybe not that game, probably not, but a big game all the same in which you'll have contributed exactly as much if not more as you'd have wanted to contribute to that first title. And at the very very odd chance you do succeed with your first try, congratz. You beat statistics, and you are also, now, IN the industry.