for fsrad:
import: .ent , .oct , .ase
export: .oct
free compiler with lightmaps?
thanx for the info nitroman!
ok, the lmts-mesh-with-lightmaps-loader works!
Here's a first screenshot with just a spot shining in a corner:
That was a 3ds with lights in it processed through LMTools loaded into irrlicht as *.lmts via my CLMTSMeshFileLoader class wich is easyly integrated with SceneManager::addExternalMeshLoader()!
I will now try out some more fancy lighting stuff with shadows and so on. Also to stress test the loader a bit with some more complex scenes.
Stay tuned...
ok, the lmts-mesh-with-lightmaps-loader works!
Here's a first screenshot with just a spot shining in a corner:
That was a 3ds with lights in it processed through LMTools loaded into irrlicht as *.lmts via my CLMTSMeshFileLoader class wich is easyly integrated with SceneManager::addExternalMeshLoader()!
I will now try out some more fancy lighting stuff with shadows and so on. Also to stress test the loader a bit with some more complex scenes.
Stay tuned...
This happend suddenly when I run the LMTools.bat.LMPack wrote: LMPack v0.2b - Copyright (c) 2002-2003 Pulsar Studio & Lord Trancos
* 3D Data successfully loaded (12 tris in 3 subsets).
* Source lightmaps successfully loaded.
* Lightmaps optimized: 0/12 (0,00%).
* Lightmaps shared: 6/12 (50,00%).
Exception EAccessViolation in module LMPack.exe at 0000B128.
Access violation at address 0040B128 in module 'LMPack.exe'. Read of address FFFFFFE0.
ERROR while PACKING lightmaps.
I changed something in the scene that causes this... have not found out yet what it is.
I'll see later, just taking a look at FSRad right now (very promising screenshots it has)...
sorry, I lost track of this thread and been answering posts without knowing your answers in lightmap stuff...
So, you are making a loader, and it's being succesful...great..
no, I am not using irrlicht for lightmaps...nor for anything.
I am not a coder
Is more as felt curious since start, as was completely free and offering a lot of formats and GFX features: an gift for an artist.
I am going to work on a project, but the coders do their own engine (tehy're used to it)
If I yet visit here is for gentle comunity and as I'd like to see irllicht loading dealing well with gfx stuff. and doing games
hmm...what do you think of the idea of me passing you a sample level (nothing fancy in the geometry, just to test) lightmapped with Gile and u test it with your lightmap loader for irrlicht ?
it'd be nice to see it in an exe (never knew if compiling in irrlicht needs some extra work...)
As you see, I continue feeling curious bout irrlicht.Also, is a way to do powerful things for free, that makes it more attractive...
bTW, about fsrad...is a radiosity lightmapper.The quality should be enormous. Near to gile[s] or Max lightmaps(if know well how to deal with those)
The disadvantage some ppl see...i don't see it. As forcing it to subdivide should not be a problem, as what you actually want to get out of a lightmaper, is the tga texture. That I already saw that fsrad did that for me.
I'd have my non subdivided model, my x file with 2 uv channels done in Ultimate, ready to have the lightmap tga assigned.
My problem is , ASE export with lights in, is something Ultimate can do, nor any free tool. And u need the lights info inside the ase, or it wont work (will output a black bitmap)
LMTOOLS does not supports normals per vertex.I was told by the author. He may release a version with support fot it.But i don't know if he will, or when.
I remember speaking with him and he was interested by Fsrad, too, as he didnt know of it till I told him.
In he free field, you have:
Slimshady : http://www.melog.ch/slimshady/
Lord Trancos tool, LMTOOLS : dxlab.tk
Fsrad http://www.fluidstudios.com/fsrad.html
In the comercial field:
-Gile[s] 40$
-Max , 3500$. And that counting u arent buying Brazil or Final render, or other GI renderer...and use just skylight with good settings...
-Lightwave has a great, great renderer.I suppose it can do lightmaps.
I have even tested painting shadows (I'm an oil painter ) over an scene, over the diffuse map, just the texture file. Like a "baked" solution, done by hand.Loaded in "multiply" mode the lightmap in Ultimate Unwrap (40$) an dit worked nicely.But depends on how u paint
And is quite a task
Or use a package to bake illumination to texture uv channel 1. Blender can't yet.Only can bake illumination to vertex colors and is not easy.
Some 3d realtime people of blender what does is does a render per wall, camera orthogonal to it, and then cut that as a texture and assign to the wall...quite a task, again.
I think that...Slim shady or LMtools, can do fo rmost levels here...
only that...a cilinder or any curved surface want be shaded properly...but there...is where a 3d painted can do: u can allways use the free tatoo (free for non comercial projects) to do what I do with my -painfully- purchased deep paint3d. For that stuff would be the same. You'd paint a gray scale shadow texture . In this case, assign th egenerated lightmap to the scene in tatoo, and go smoothing an repainting with black (very subtle) shadows the curved surfaces...could do if ur careful.
I hope your function for lightmaps end up well
So, you are making a loader, and it's being succesful...great..
no, I am not using irrlicht for lightmaps...nor for anything.
I am not a coder
Is more as felt curious since start, as was completely free and offering a lot of formats and GFX features: an gift for an artist.
I am going to work on a project, but the coders do their own engine (tehy're used to it)
If I yet visit here is for gentle comunity and as I'd like to see irllicht loading dealing well with gfx stuff. and doing games
hmm...what do you think of the idea of me passing you a sample level (nothing fancy in the geometry, just to test) lightmapped with Gile and u test it with your lightmap loader for irrlicht ?
it'd be nice to see it in an exe (never knew if compiling in irrlicht needs some extra work...)
As you see, I continue feeling curious bout irrlicht.Also, is a way to do powerful things for free, that makes it more attractive...
bTW, about fsrad...is a radiosity lightmapper.The quality should be enormous. Near to gile[s] or Max lightmaps(if know well how to deal with those)
The disadvantage some ppl see...i don't see it. As forcing it to subdivide should not be a problem, as what you actually want to get out of a lightmaper, is the tga texture. That I already saw that fsrad did that for me.
I'd have my non subdivided model, my x file with 2 uv channels done in Ultimate, ready to have the lightmap tga assigned.
My problem is , ASE export with lights in, is something Ultimate can do, nor any free tool. And u need the lights info inside the ase, or it wont work (will output a black bitmap)
LMTOOLS does not supports normals per vertex.I was told by the author. He may release a version with support fot it.But i don't know if he will, or when.
I remember speaking with him and he was interested by Fsrad, too, as he didnt know of it till I told him.
In he free field, you have:
Slimshady : http://www.melog.ch/slimshady/
Lord Trancos tool, LMTOOLS : dxlab.tk
Fsrad http://www.fluidstudios.com/fsrad.html
In the comercial field:
-Gile[s] 40$
-Max , 3500$. And that counting u arent buying Brazil or Final render, or other GI renderer...and use just skylight with good settings...
-Lightwave has a great, great renderer.I suppose it can do lightmaps.
I have even tested painting shadows (I'm an oil painter
) over an scene, over the diffuse map, just the texture file. Like a "baked" solution, done by hand.Loaded in "multiply" mode the lightmap in Ultimate Unwrap (40$) an dit worked nicely.But depends on how u paint And is quite a task
Or use a package to bake illumination to texture uv channel 1. Blender can't yet.Only can bake illumination to vertex colors and is not easy.
Some 3d realtime people of blender what does is does a render per wall, camera orthogonal to it, and then cut that as a texture and assign to the wall...quite a task, again.
I think that...Slim shady or LMtools, can do fo rmost levels here...
only that...a cilinder or any curved surface want be shaded properly...but there...is where a 3d painted can do: u can allways use the free tatoo (free for non comercial projects) to do what I do with my -painfully- purchased deep paint3d. For that stuff would be the same. You'd paint a gray scale shadow texture . In this case, assign th egenerated lightmap to the scene in tatoo, and go smoothing an repainting with black (very subtle) shadows the curved surfaces...could do if ur careful.
I hope your function for lightmaps end up well
Finally making games again!
http://www.konekogames.com
http://www.konekogames.com
@spongebob:
thanx, interesting information!
@Fussel:
yes, I will make the source available after I have it cleaned up and optimized a bit.
@vermeer:
good idea of you passing me a sample level! But my loader is more a LMTS-file-format loader than a lightmap loader. So it should be in this format. Can you gernerate that?
I'm now thinking about writing an OCT-file-loader for Irrlicht. But then I need also to write a something-other-then-ase-oct-ent-file-loader for FSRad, since I got no 3dmax.
Could you send me your sample level also in ase, oct or ent format so I can play around a bit with FSRad?
Btw, what sounds very interesting in important.txt of FSRad is: "Although the processor can read OCT files, ENT files are better because they contain materials that alllow entire polygons to be emitters, rather than simple point lights."
thanx, interesting information!
@Fussel:
yes, I will make the source available after I have it cleaned up and optimized a bit.
@vermeer:
good idea of you passing me a sample level! But my loader is more a LMTS-file-format loader than a lightmap loader. So it should be in this format. Can you gernerate that?
I'm now thinking about writing an OCT-file-loader for Irrlicht. But then I need also to write a something-other-then-ase-oct-ent-file-loader for FSRad, since I got no 3dmax.
Could you send me your sample level also in ase, oct or ent format so I can play around a bit with FSRad?
Btw, what sounds very interesting in important.txt of FSRad is: "Although the processor can read OCT files, ENT files are better because they contain materials that alllow entire polygons to be emitters, rather than simple point lights."
euh...I didn't understand well how LMtools work, and also, I wanted some more power....
I was going to make a giles lightmap, but i gotta make a minimal level...and as you say you must load other type of lightmap, and certain person is urging me to make certain character model...I think I will leave it for more in advance, later, that probably an x file with 2 channels and a lightmap tga assigned, would be possible. As then, any software output will work for lightmaps...
the problem you will have with fsrad is there's no tool to produce lights and save as ase, for free.
Only perhaps, Blender, as there was an ASE script, but maybe not been updated fo rlater versions...and maybe no light export. (ppl often do not support every feature in a format...)
Indeed, blender has quite powerful lights and camera system...It's an already powerful editor, checking how the ase plugin works, would be interestingm as ase is ascii, and supposedly easy to parse for any coder...
Blender has spot, omni, infinite, and area lights. Has radiosity, cameras, camera paths..etc.
No better level editor out there, indeed.
(other than Max )
I was going to make a giles lightmap, but i gotta make a minimal level...and as you say you must load other type of lightmap, and certain person is urging me to make certain character model...I think I will leave it for more in advance, later, that probably an x file with 2 channels and a lightmap tga assigned, would be possible. As then, any software output will work for lightmaps...
the problem you will have with fsrad is there's no tool to produce lights and save as ase, for free.
Only perhaps, Blender, as there was an ASE script, but maybe not been updated fo rlater versions...and maybe no light export. (ppl often do not support every feature in a format...)
Indeed, blender has quite powerful lights and camera system...It's an already powerful editor, checking how the ase plugin works, would be interestingm as ase is ascii, and supposedly easy to parse for any coder...
Blender has spot, omni, infinite, and area lights. Has radiosity, cameras, camera paths..etc.
No better level editor out there, indeed.
(other than Max
)Finally making games again!
http://www.konekogames.com
http://www.konekogames.com
-
nitroman
I don't have 3dsmax myself so for the moment I don't know how to export to fsrad with lights...Could you send me your sample level also in ase, oct or ent format so I can play around a bit with FSRad?
Btw, what sounds very interesting in important.txt of FSRad is: "Although the processor can read OCT files, ENT files are better because they contain materials that alllow entire polygons to be emitters, rather than simple point lights."
But in the "file archive" section of the fluid studio site, there is a sample file of a cornell box .ent
check there:
http://www.fluidstudios.com/pub/FluidStudios/Radiosity/
and download cornellbox.ent
hope it helps.
-
nitroman
no problemo! 
I tried to compile the cornell box and see it with the oct viewer and I must say that the result are very good.
I'm just asking myself how it would be possible to use fsrad with only free tools...
Because you need 3dsmax to export to ase...
But so why using fsrad if 3dsmax already have a "render to texture" system that allow to bake all the light effects in lightmaps?
maybe we would need a 3ds to ent converter (???)
I think 3ds can contains lights (as I read in the lmtools manual...) but most modelers don't export them...
It would need a lot of work I think...
unfortunately I'm not enough good at coding to write such converters... so I can't help you...
But I can test it and give comments...
Anyway good work, I stay tuned.
I tried to compile the cornell box and see it with the oct viewer and I must say that the result are very good.
I'm just asking myself how it would be possible to use fsrad with only free tools...
Because you need 3dsmax to export to ase...
But so why using fsrad if 3dsmax already have a "render to texture" system that allow to bake all the light effects in lightmaps?
maybe we would need a 3ds to ent converter (???)
I think 3ds can contains lights (as I read in the lmtools manual...) but most modelers don't export them...
It would need a lot of work I think...
unfortunately I'm not enough good at coding to write such converters... so I can't help you...
But I can test it and give comments...
Anyway good work, I stay tuned.
Having max...well, you'd still need to make a format (or use one of the avilable ones that supports 2 uv channels) or use a format that irrlicht can read. I mean that has 2 uv channels, and asigns to the second the max generated lightmap tga.
But yes, for what is the thing, Max is way enough.
it's used professionally for this. Often using Final Render or Brazil plugins.
I have seenit done so with lots of quality.But also, the samples at fsrad site look very "pro".
If you get it working, is the best solution for free, no doubt. WAY better than bsp, than lmtools, or slimshady. Not only more quality, but also suppoting any cruved surface, etc.
For the problem of ase thing..yes, that's a problem...
Loook, new idea. Anim8or does have 3ds export...i don't know if it realy exports the light on that 3ds...if it would, you'd need to read it...but..is a binary file...I don't know how you'd red it...
Indeed. New thought. Anim8or IS indeed so easy to handle that any coder or newbie artist can handle in no time.And after all, in thi scase we only want a quick and easy lights (maybe also camera in a future) scene builder.
There's an ascii text file with format *.an8 specs, which indeed is an ascii format.I have seen even non experienced vb coders do wonders with it.
Other posibility is using the *.c file that Anim8or exports.
Other posibility is using 3ds file from anim8or, if it includes lights positions, but imho the most powerful thing is use the an8or format or *.c format, and parse that text file, and make your code output a basic ASE file of it. ASE is said to be easy format. I think this all should be easy.
You'd just take lights properties an dpositions, etc, from what is written in the an8 file, or c file.
And while I cannot explain any of you the use of Blender in 2 posts, I can explain the basic use of Anim8or in some lines. Is thought to be made uber easy for the new comer. And anim8or has spot, omni, and infinite lights, and is advanced in many other stuff, while dumb easy.
for ASE format information, besides getting the specs as always, here's a good tut of it :
http://www.gametutorials.com/Tutorials/ ... GL_Pg4.htm
ok, 3ds is out in Anim8or :
Steve: "...Anim8or only exports static objects to the .3ds format. It does not export any lighting parameters."
It leaves it to *.AN8 , and *.c
Important info about this :
"There is an easy way to use Anim8or models in your own C programs. You can export an Object as a C source file with the Object->Export command if you choose the "C Source File (.c)" format. I have posted a sample application (with source code) that spins a model around at
www.anim8or.com/resources/a8viewer00.zip . See the Resources page www.anim8or.com/resources/index.html for more details."
OK, this is what I was looking for :
http://www.anim8or.com/resources/an8_format.txt
That is what you need. That, and the ase tut in gametutorials, plus the specs o ASE format.
If you need it, you can tell me to export an scene in c and an8 formats, to see which you prefer. I mean, if you get interested by thi spossibility.
ALSO:
"Actually you can easily skip parts that you aren't interested in. Everything in the .an8 format is a chunk with a key identifier followed by an open curley brace, possibly some more stuff, then a closing curley brace. If you don't recognize the key simply skip over things, counting open {'s and closing }'s until they match. (You do have a clean tokenizer, ala "lex", don't you?) This allows you to write a very simple, basic loader without much code that will handle any file. You can then add new things as you want."
"Yes, you are free to use anything that you create in Anim8or as you like. This includes using the .an8 file format in other applications"
And I must point out that Anim8or is a FREWWARE (not open source, but doesnt mind for this)
"Linux:
Using Anim8or on Linux
All Linux fans will be glad to know that that you can run Anim8or too. It reportedly works quite well on Redhat 7.1 using WINE."
"The beauty of the .an8 format is that unrecognized chunks can easily be skipped. Anim8or should ignore any new chunks that you want to add. ."
I DEFINITELY think is easier an dbetter way to go the anim8or route for this...It would be non practical to pretend to do it with blender. [ while I keep thinking for character animation is good the blender+x route]
Easier to code, easier to handle as graphic app also.
Not important, but a list of some of the many anim8or utilities, done by users...
http://www.angelfire.com/electronic2/ba ... lists.html
But yes, for what is the thing, Max is way enough.
it's used professionally for this. Often using Final Render or Brazil plugins.
I have seenit done so with lots of quality.But also, the samples at fsrad site look very "pro".
If you get it working, is the best solution for free, no doubt. WAY better than bsp, than lmtools, or slimshady. Not only more quality, but also suppoting any cruved surface, etc.
For the problem of ase thing..yes, that's a problem...
Loook, new idea. Anim8or does have 3ds export...i don't know if it realy exports the light on that 3ds...if it would, you'd need to read it...but..is a binary file...I don't know how you'd red it...
Indeed. New thought. Anim8or IS indeed so easy to handle that any coder or newbie artist can handle in no time.And after all, in thi scase we only want a quick and easy lights (maybe also camera in a future
) scene builder.There's an ascii text file with format *.an8 specs, which indeed is an ascii format.I have seen even non experienced vb coders do wonders with it.
Other posibility is using the *.c file that Anim8or exports.
Other posibility is using 3ds file from anim8or, if it includes lights positions, but imho the most powerful thing is use the an8or format or *.c format, and parse that text file, and make your code output a basic ASE file of it. ASE is said to be easy format. I think this all should be easy.
You'd just take lights properties an dpositions, etc, from what is written in the an8 file, or c file.
And while I cannot explain any of you the use of Blender in 2 posts, I can explain the basic use of Anim8or in some lines. Is thought to be made uber easy for the new comer. And anim8or has spot, omni, and infinite lights, and is advanced in many other stuff, while dumb easy.
for ASE format information, besides getting the specs as always, here's a good tut of it :
http://www.gametutorials.com/Tutorials/ ... GL_Pg4.htm
ok, 3ds is out in Anim8or :
Steve: "...Anim8or only exports static objects to the .3ds format. It does not export any lighting parameters."
It leaves it to *.AN8 , and *.c
Important info about this :
"There is an easy way to use Anim8or models in your own C programs. You can export an Object as a C source file with the Object->Export command if you choose the "C Source File (.c)" format. I have posted a sample application (with source code) that spins a model around at
www.anim8or.com/resources/a8viewer00.zip . See the Resources page www.anim8or.com/resources/index.html for more details."
OK, this is what I was looking for :
http://www.anim8or.com/resources/an8_format.txt
That is what you need. That, and the ase tut in gametutorials, plus the specs o ASE format.
If you need it, you can tell me to export an scene in c and an8 formats, to see which you prefer. I mean, if you get interested by thi spossibility.
ALSO:
"Actually you can easily skip parts that you aren't interested in. Everything in the .an8 format is a chunk with a key identifier followed by an open curley brace, possibly some more stuff, then a closing curley brace. If you don't recognize the key simply skip over things, counting open {'s and closing }'s until they match. (You do have a clean tokenizer, ala "lex", don't you?) This allows you to write a very simple, basic loader without much code that will handle any file. You can then add new things as you want."
"Yes, you are free to use anything that you create in Anim8or as you like. This includes using the .an8 file format in other applications"
And I must point out that Anim8or is a FREWWARE (not open source, but doesnt mind for this)
"Linux:
Using Anim8or on Linux
All Linux fans will be glad to know that that you can run Anim8or too. It reportedly works quite well on Redhat 7.1 using WINE."
"The beauty of the .an8 format is that unrecognized chunks can easily be skipped. Anim8or should ignore any new chunks that you want to add. ."
I DEFINITELY think is easier an dbetter way to go the anim8or route for this...It would be non practical to pretend to do it with blender. [ while I keep thinking for character animation is good the blender+x route]
Easier to code, easier to handle as graphic app also.
Not important, but a list of some of the many anim8or utilities, done by users...
http://www.angelfire.com/electronic2/ba ... lists.html
Finally making games again!
http://www.konekogames.com
http://www.konekogames.com