Irrlicht Engine

Posted: **Fri Feb 23, 2007 7:07 pm**

WhiskeyJim wrote:wishes us good luck just because it's about having fun and working as a team.

Yes, good luck anyway!!

Just remember that you can always turn your game into another project when this one become too hard to handle

Posted: **Fri Feb 23, 2007 8:09 pm**

I'm making a MMORPG

as first project I say no... before starting my project i could already build small games,

IPv6 wrote: Then consider redoing EVERYTHING from scratch because you`ll finally start to understand what you really want.

Thats the most hardest of all, we started over for several times, every time its faster to rebuild but it takes lots of time...

IPv6 wrote:After hour or two server memory will be in total chaos because of fragmentation (new delete every 100 millisecond), you will start to get errors "don`t have enough memory" on server with 2 Gb RAM!

Yeh, big problem.

bitplane wrote: MMO is the kind of project that a large team of experienced people would need to dedicate 4 years of their lives to achieve.

Think twice what you want, don't start that big with a world. Start small with enough options for later.

Posted: **Fri Feb 23, 2007 9:05 pm**

Well, I wish you 'good luck', though a rather hollow and sad one rather than an enthusiastic one. There's a severe lack of artists, and you'll be hogging some of them for several years on a project that will never get finished.
Oh well, if you won't listen to the experienced guys then it's your own problem I guess

edit:

strong99 wrote:Think twice what you want, don't start that big with a world. Start small with enough options for later.

even if you don't start with a world, you still need an idea that is good enough to handle a world

Posted: **Sat Feb 24, 2007 12:25 am**

Let's start a pool on when the project will be called off. I call March 22, 2007 at 3:30 PM.

Seriously, don't even think about a MMOG of any kind (RPG or not) until you have some serious funding, a crew working under you, and no interest in dating.

It's hard enough to design a single player/multiplayer hotseat game with 20 or so levels. You'll need enough areas to accomodate players, otherwise if enough log in you'll end up with player models stacked on top of each other.

That's if you even make it to the massive part. If you know anything about networking then something like Balder's Gate or Prince of Qin, where one player will start a game and others will dial into his machine, may not be beyond reach, but servers cost $$$, and if you want a true MMOG you'll need at least three of them. Bandwidth costs money, too, and from what I've seen it ain't cheap.

If you decide to switch to a single player game, or single player with the option for network play, then I'll wish you luck. Finances alone will keep this from becoming an MMOG, so unless you can get investors or your parents are multi-millionaires I can already tell you it's not going to happen.

Posted: **Sat Feb 24, 2007 12:30 am**

http://www.multiverse.net/

I came accross something that you might find interesting.

Its called the Multiverse, and its for MMOG development, in the beta stage (non beta soon) that should already do what you are trying to do. Also as an added bonus, I guess you can change the gameplay via JAVA and C#(if you need to alter the client)

well this is easyer

ABOUT Multiverse...http://www.multiverse.net/about/index.jsp?cid=5&scid=0

The Multiverse Solution
Multiverse's unique technology platform will change the economics of virtual world development by empowering independent game developers to create high-quality, Massively Multiplayer Online Games (MMOGs) and non-game virtual worlds for less money and in less time than ever before. Multiverse solves the prohibitive challenges of game creation by providing developers with a comprehensive, pre-coded client-server infrastructure and tools, a wide range of free content--including a complete game for modification--and a built-in market of consumers. The Multiverse Network will give video game players a single program--the Multiverse Client--that lets them play all of the MMOGs and visit all of the non-game virtual worlds built on the Multiverse platform.

For the first time, indie developers will have the opportunity to create the virtual worlds they've been dreaming about. And many of these new worlds will attract players who are completely ignored by today’s MMOG publishers.

This is the start of a revolution.

Licensing info: http://www.multiverse.net/licensing/ind ... d=4&scid=3

LICENSING OVERVIEW

With Multiverse, you pay nothing upfront. Download our entire SDK (software development kit) with our full technology, or our free assets, and spend as long as you like building your virtual world. Have as many testers or free players as you like, and you won't have to pay us anything. We only make our money through revenue-sharing, when you charge consumers.

If you don't make money, we don't make money. And importantly, if you never charge anything, you never have to pay us anything.

You can build your game with whatever revenue model you want--subscription, flat fee, in-game micropayments, whatever works for you. Multiverse handles consumer billing and credit card processing. You don't have to worry about deadbeat charges or any of the other pitfalls of financial transactions.

Publishers usually only let you keep 8% to 20% of the money your game makes. Multiverse increases that amount to 50% to 70%! We will announce more details about pricing soon.

Here's what you get when you use Multiverse:

The complete, enterprise-level client-server technology package.
A set of pre-coded virtual world functionality plug-ins, including game rules, combat, basic physics, et cetera. These are customizable and replaceable.

Our full set of virtual world creation and administration tools.
A starter set of game assets for multiple game genres, including models, animations, textures, sounds, and user interface packages.
An actual MMOG for modding.
Full documentation.
A built-in market of consumers.
Consumer technical support for the platform.

Network services, including:
user registration and authentication
world location and search
content-rating system
messaging system
transaction system
accounting and billing system (includes credit card processing)

Hope this helps.

Posted: **Mon Mar 05, 2007 5:17 pm**

Required reading: So you want to make your own MMORPG.

Of course, nobody ever believes that it applies to them, because no dev team in the history of MMORPGs has ever had the same degree of gosh darned can-do enthusiasm.

OK, serious suggestion time. The most important thing in a MMO is the network design (which encapsulates your object design and how to pass information about those objects), followed by the robustness of the server implementation. Until you get those right, the client is a distraction If you get your network architecture wrong, and the vast majority of people do, then you'll be playing catch up for ever. Even Blizzard pooched Warcraft, by trusting clients too much. Only because they're Blizzard do they have the resources (and the leverage over their customers) to install spyware and to monitor players constantly to try and catch them doing things that the server shouldn't trust their clients to do in the first place.

As a practical upshot of this, your first implementation should be a text version. Seriously, write a MUD. Just dump a text description of your network packets to the console.

Once that's robust, then maybe (maybe) you're ready to move some bitmaps around on a 2D background. But any time you spend on the presentation will detract from you refactoring the network and server. If you start work on a 3D client representation before your network and server are completely stable and secure, then you're doomed, irrevocably.

And if you don't have the self-discipline to resist the temptation to lash up a 3D demo of what your game client will look like... then you're doomed.

Really serious suggestion? Contribute to Worldforge instead.

Posted: **Tue Mar 06, 2007 3:04 am**

I like how everyone forgets the most important part of an mmo.

BANDWIDTH unless you have a few million to invest you ain't doing it.

Posted: **Tue Mar 06, 2007 3:48 am**

ya know, the only bit of advice i can give is this: never attempt to make one alone unless you have all the time in the world at your call and beckon

Posted: **Tue Mar 06, 2007 2:05 pm**

Midnight wrote:I like how everyone forgets the most important part of an mmo.

BANDWIDTH unless you have a few million to invest you ain't doing it.

Oh, tish, their 10,000,000 players will be happy to donate endless funds to pay for it.

Posted: **Wed Mar 07, 2007 5:49 pm**

One of the teams I code for (Plantasy Studios) is presently writing an MMORPG. I'm not involved in the project but it's always interesting to see what they're up to. However, without the financial backing of a large Swedish ISP, their project would go nowhere and would just be another pipe dream. So yes, bandwidth is definately one of the most important aspects of any MMORPG.

Posted: **Thu Mar 08, 2007 11:59 am**

Hey, nice hints and ideas everyone.

*Still planning..*

Posted: **Thu Mar 08, 2007 5:24 pm**

Some people don't have limited bandwidth

I think there's even some dedicated server hosts that give you infinite bandwidth/month for an extra fee.

Posted: **Thu Mar 08, 2007 11:48 pm**

for instance, my host is local, and I get an unlimited bandwidth and as much memory as I need.

Posted: **Fri Mar 09, 2007 12:44 am**

lostclimategames wrote:for instance, my host is local, and I get an unlimited bandwidth and as much memory as I need.

Likewise.

Posted: **Fri Mar 09, 2007 1:50 am**

really what do you mean local?

man I need to move there.

how much do you pay for unlimited bandwidth?

there are ways to overcome even bandwidth problems.. having extreamly compressed formats or getting an ISP to invest it for you.

even finding a way to get people to preorder or even pay after the fact but these are bad business models when you could make a single player rpg with better graphics and use the income to fund larger and larger projects.

I can't think of a single novice programmer whos first release was an mmo of any sort.. most not even multiplayer.. I think you're setting insurmountable goals but I suppose anything can be done.

good luck thats all I can say.

Irrlicht Engine

An MMORPG - Can we do it? Our plan.