Which Physics library to use???

white tiger · Post by **white tiger** » Sun Nov 25, 2007 4:33 pm

If you look at the IrrNewt vehicle demo you'll see that when the vehicle is reset the wheels bounce right up through the chassis about 4 feet (IIRC).

just call update() after reset() [and recall update before drawall]

That's if you can call a block with a torus on each corner a vehicle.

it's an example. the torus and the 'block' (a 'box' in english) reduce the size of the zip and don't occur in license things for a 3rd part car model.

anyway, a box with a torus is better than a car wich can drive above the water in your car demo (maybe Jesus drive it?)

IrrNewt also assumes the front and rear axles are symetric, which in car models it is not.

i have already taught you the difference between ICar and IVehicleSimple. the last assume absolute nothing and can build all types of vehicles, also with asymmetric tyres.

The biggest issue you may encounter with IrrNewt is the "single material" issue. If you look at the racetrack in my first driving demo IrrNewt treats it as one single material - no separate materials for grass, tarmac, dirt, etc. The author of IrrNewt said that the way I wanted it (kept as one single physics entity) could not be done and we had an argument where basically I said it was an easy engineering task and implied that he was incompetent.

you spend hours to get your car move while it took about 30 minutes for me to write the full car example, you spend some additional hours to adjust settings for the car with the example, the irrnewt source and your previous expirence with newton. Am i the incompetent?

A few months later he tracked me down in another thread and started on me again; I called his bluff and explained the principles of a solution and have heard nothing since.

Because you started to insult me without any reason, so i have stopped the discussion, but u are continuing.

BTW there isn't need to modify irrnewt for this. you only need to write your own code. getpolys() return an array of polys of the model (triangles or optimized rectangles). simply check the collision against the elements in the array and in the material callback change the material settings to the new values of that poly (no matter the previous values). the specific funcs can change the values for 1 calculation then go back to the old values

Or, since you have the IrrNewt source code, you could modifiy it to your requirements.

Sure. just don't follow sio2's example or the PC may explode in your face

Last I checked you couldn't download Newton or IrrNewt, though. Newton may be temporarily down; the IrrNewt author seems to be ignoring the pleas in his own thread for a valid download link.

Newton is currently up http://www.newtongamedynamics.com/downloads.html IrrNewt is down 'cause i don't have time to maintain it. in the irrnewt thread on this forum there are '3rd part' links btw

SwitchCase · Post by **SwitchCase** » Sun Nov 25, 2007 5:05 pm

sio2... white tiger has created and maintained something completely free of charge using his own spare time. I think to slag him or his work off, is out of order. I am not agreeing or disagreeing with your comments but the way in which you have made those comments is pathetic.

P.S. Let's try to not go off topic into a frenzy of using the word incompetent.

sio2 · Post by **sio2** » Sun Nov 25, 2007 5:18 pm

I've searched the Newton forum and i found that assign 2 materials to the same node is impossible, in newton and in the real world. If you want two materials split into 2 nodes.

This is what you said on Oct 15. Now you say what I asked for can be done, but only after I told you a way of approaching the problem.

You haven't posted for around six weeks and there's been plenty of people asking for help and download links. You've ignored your own thread for months with people asking for help. I post the word "irrnewt" and suddenly you pop up, and that's the second time you've done it. How about helping other people instead of stalking me?

IrrNewt is down 'cause i don't have time to maintain it.

No more needs to be said on the subject of IrrNewt. The author would rather spend time trying to defend it rather than actually making it available to end-users.

Halifax · Post by **Halifax** » Sun Nov 25, 2007 6:13 pm

SwitchCase wrote:sio2... white tiger has created and maintained something completely free of charge using his own spare time. I think to slag him or his work off, is out of order. I am not agreeing or disagreeing with your comments but the way in which you have made those comments is pathetic.

P.S. Let's try to not go off topic into a frenzy of using the word incompetent.

Who gives a crap, plenty of people do things completely free of charage, and better than irrNewt! Bullet was done completely free of charge, with full sourc released.

It is up to the author to choose, but that doesn't mean we bow down to them, and not report problems.

sio2 tried to help white tiger out in the last forum, and then he began to take things wrong, and started to decimate sio2 with insults. If that didn't happen, then I would probably agree with you, but I can understand how sio2 feels.

SwitchCase · Post by **SwitchCase** » Sun Nov 25, 2007 8:04 pm

Halifax wrote:
SwitchCase wrote:sio2... white tiger has created and maintained something completely free of charge using his own spare time. I think to slag him or his work off, is out of order. I am not agreeing or disagreeing with your comments but the way in which you have made those comments is pathetic.

P.S. Let's try to not go off topic into a frenzy of using the word incompetent.
Who gives a crap, plenty of people do things completely free of charage, and better than irrNewt! Bullet was done completely free of charge, with full sourc released.

It is up to the author to choose, but that doesn't mean we bow down to them, and not report problems.

sio2 tried to help white tiger out in the last forum, and then he began to take things wrong, and started to decimate sio2 with insults. If that didn't happen, then I would probably agree with you, but I can understand how sio2 feels.

Im afraid I didn't read the other forum. I do apologise to sio2 if what you say is the case.

Vsk · Post by **Vsk** » Mon Nov 26, 2007 2:40 pm

rogerborg wrote:If you had to choose today, then Newton would be out, given that the download links and forum are both 404 (as is IrrNewt). Also, Newton and IrrNewt are both run by people that I consider to be borderline sociopaths. It takes one to know one.

The Magic 8 Ball says that all the signs point to Bullet over ODE, but it's been known to be wrong.

waoah!!.

Well I have talked and red Julio conversation and white tiger conversation pretty much and never saw a "borderline sociopaths" behavior. And believe me, I hate "borderline sociopaht".
For the contrary, they are kind and always help with humillity in special Julio.
I read White tiger eniter irrnewt post and what I saw (from beggining) that some "advaced" c++ programer started criticied his programming style, and some points didn't be tolds in a kind way at all.
anyway white tiger responded justifing or trying to justify without offending anyone or trying to do it. And even changed for what this people ask.

I am using irrnewt and making a tanks simulator almost without a problem (and I AM A BEGGINER on physic engines).
It turns turret , cannon, shoots, and moves prrety well, it took me just minutes adding 18 wheel to a IVehicleSimple and make it move without a problem. (I don't know how an experiencie programmer could take more time

)
I add a huge terrain , house.. and more.
The only problems that I have is that my aproach (18 wheels) make so much contacts points and add much tanks slow down the framerate.

And even Julio (the newton developer himself) has offers to better my code to fix this problems!!! What a sociopaht!

By the way, I am almost a computer Engeniering and understand quite well software enginering including sofwtware design and yes, maybe WhiteTiger code (initialy) had some not good cod styling and some poor desing, but he chaged pretty much and PRETTY WELL. His code now are easy to read,and modifing, and mantain (what I think to do in nexts weaks).

By the way white tiger, try to cotact me when you can.
Sorry about my english.
Greetings.

white tiger · Post by **white tiger** » Thu Nov 29, 2007 1:02 pm

It is up to the author to choose, but that doesn't mean we bow down to them, and not report problems.

if someone want to report a bug i will thank her\him.

sio2 never reported a bug. his goal is to prove he is a sort of God of programming. he report all sort of problems only to mud the works of other, not to report bugs.

in the previous thread he reported a problem that he can't move the car. good. i asked him to post the source code wich initialize the car (since in the example the car moves)
he incredibily accused me to try to STEAL his game engine code. i continuously repeated him i don't want the full source code but only the code wich initialize the car. i have also noticed i have already written a similar code before him in the car example; i can't steal a thing i already have. nothing. the discussion ended with him declaring he finally fixed the bug that WOULD BE in my code, but he never posted where in my code, what's the fix and neither what was the bug exactly, nothing. only that the car didn't move and he solved the bug in my code.

this is because he don't want to report bugs. he want to assure the others thing he is the best programmer, he solve everything.

also in this post he didn't make suggestion. he only try to convince the poster to don't use irrnewt assuring the more ludicrous things.

This is what you said on Oct 15. Now you say what I asked for can be done, but only after I told you a way of approaching the problem.

u asked to assign to the same node 2 materials. that's mean a poly would have the friction of the wood and the friction of the stone simultaneously. after u "explained" the method (afterwards i asked him a lot of time, of course

) i understood u want different materials per different polys of the same physics entity, not different materials to a all polys of the same physics entity as u initially asked.

if you can't make the question clear post the method immediately, not after i asked u 10 times at least. or find a way urself. getpolys() is a intuitive name. only a suggestion, i'm the incompetent

white tiger · Post by **white tiger** » Thu Nov 29, 2007 1:09 pm

Vsk wrote:
rogerborg wrote:If you had to choose today, then Newton would be out, given that the download links and forum are both 404 (as is IrrNewt). Also, Newton and IrrNewt are both run by people that I consider to be borderline sociopaths. It takes one to know one.

The Magic 8 Ball says that all the signs point to Bullet over ODE, but it's been known to be wrong.
waoah!!.

Well I have talked and red Julio conversation and white tiger conversation pretty much and never saw a "borderline sociopaths" behavior. And believe me, I hate "borderline sociopaht".
For the contrary, they are kind and always help with humillity in special Julio.
I read White tiger eniter irrnewt post and what I saw (from beggining) that some "advaced" c++ programer started criticied his programming style, and some points didn't be tolds in a kind way at all.
anyway white tiger responded justifing or trying to justify without offending anyone or trying to do it. And even changed for what this people ask.

I am using irrnewt and making a tanks simulator almost without a problem (and I AM A BEGGINER on physic engines).
It turns turret , cannon, shoots, and moves prrety well, it took me just minutes adding 18 wheel to a IVehicleSimple and make it move without a problem. (I don't know how an experiencie programmer could take more time )
I add a huge terrain , house.. and more.
The only problems that I have is that my aproach (18 wheels) make so much contacts points and add much tanks slow down the framerate.

And even Julio (the newton developer himself) has offers to better my code to fix this problems!!! What a sociopaht!

By the way, I am almost a computer Engeniering and understand quite well software enginering including sofwtware design and yes, maybe WhiteTiger code (initialy) had some not good cod styling and some poor desing, but he chaged pretty much and PRETTY WELL. His code now are easy to read,and modifing, and mantain (what I think to do in nexts weaks).

By the way white tiger, try to cotact me when you can.
Sorry about my english.
Greetings.

thanks to say your POV

what kind of help do you need?

Vsk · Post by **Vsk** » Thu Nov 29, 2007 4:40 pm

Hi, don't worry about the people who doesn't care in serious discution.

Anyway, I have some punctual problems, some mines other (just litlle ones) the wrapper and other about propositions.

Well, my problem is that I implemented a hinge joint betwen the turret and the chassis of a tanks. I have done the same about the cannon and th turret.
I have put the pivot and set the stifiness to almost 0 and move the centre of mass of the turret to this pivot.
Then I apply angular velocity to turn the turret but it makes my tank shake to the oposit side of turn.
I had the same problem about the cannon and movin the cannon centre of mass to the turn pivot resolve my problem, but not about the turret.
What could it be. (I already ask julio, he ask me to go into the next newton version but actually I can do this (for a weeks)).
Other one, ¿how can I get the angular velociti of a IvehicleTire???)

-Second, you must add the "setIrrtoNewt()" and "setNewtToIrr()" functions!!.
I think this is important. I had some problems becasue for example the functions that manages centre of mass you didn' use the conversion but in other you do, so I had to fixed in my program (after I realizad the problem

).

-Third, what about migrating irrnewt to next newton version

?. Julio say it is much better and even faster.

Thanks in advance.

white tiger · Post by **white tiger** » Fri Nov 30, 2007 10:32 am

Well, my problem is that I implemented a hinge joint betwen the turret and the chassis of a tanks. I have done the same about the cannon and th turret.
I have put the pivot and set the stifiness to almost 0 and move the centre of mass of the turret to this pivot.
Then I apply angular velocity to turn the turret but it makes my tank shake to the oposit side of turn.
I had the same problem about the cannon and movin the cannon centre of mass to the turn pivot resolve my problem, but not about the turret.
What could it be. (I already ask julio, he ask me to go into the next newton version but actually I can do this (for a weeks)).

i had the same problem with character controlling some time ago. i tried to rotate it applying angular velocity and my char shaked in the opposite side. after some debug i found out that, for some reason, newton only accepts omega between 0-pi radians (not know why). i asked in the forum and they answered to set directly the rotation of the body without using the angular velocity, but i have fully understood the problem. btw i solved this way. it should work also for u.

Other one, ¿how can I get the angular velociti of a IvehicleTire???)

irrnewt doesn't wrap NewtonVehicleGetTireOmega

for the moment you can use this to get the angular velocity along the pin axis

float Omega = NewtonVehicleGetTireOmega(your_vehicle->getNewtonJoint(), your_tire->getNewtonTireId());

Second, you must add the "setIrrtoNewt()" and "setNewtToIrr()" functions!!.
I think this is important. I had some problems becasue for example the functions that manages centre of mass you didn' use the conversion but in other you do, so I had to fixed in my program (after I realizad the problem ).

u're right

centre of mass don't use the conversion

but i think it's more intuitive a setIrrToNewtConversionConstant or something like that and simply calculate 1/x for the other

Third, what about migrating irrnewt to next newton version ?. Julio say it is much better and even faster.

do u mean when it'll be out? in the download page there is the 1.53 version (or is my browser playing tricks?)

colinwilcox · Post by **colinwilcox** » Fri Nov 30, 2007 8:54 pm

Newton 1.53 is the most recent as far as I know.

Anyway, I was checking out the irrnewt system for the past few days. It seems pretty nice and it is quite helpful. I wouldn't complain about it per say, though I would prefer having more up to date examples... seeing as I am rather new to the entire Irrlicht scene, and only picked up my rusty old C++ skills a week or two ago.

I was having a hard time getting it to work with the 1.4b Irrlicht version, what with constant createPhysicsWorld crashes and whatnot. I'd recompiled everything and read other people's fixes on these forums but still no luck.

Anyway, I'm gonna give it a shot with the newly released 1.4 and see how it goes.

Vsk · Post by **Vsk** » Tue Dec 04, 2007 2:53 pm

I had the same problem. But I fixed.
You MUST be sure to change all .dll an .lib for the ones you recompiled.
I was recompiling but there was some .dll or .lib that still I was using the old one.
Check for all .dll and .lib from irrlicht and irrnewt and overwrited with the ones you generated and the .dll an .lib from irlicht that you want to use.
THEN:
There is a bug on irrlicht that made that examples from irrnewt don't work.
take a look at irrnewt post, there is explained.
Anyway you should change only a line (if I remember well) in every example and recompiled them.

This only apply for irrlicht 1.3.1.
Irrlicht 1.4 chage its api( I guess) so you should chagen (if need) some irrnewt parts if you want to use the realease.

I hope it helps.

colinwilcox · Post by **colinwilcox** » Sun Dec 09, 2007 1:55 am

Yeah, cool, thanks.

I got it working with 1.4 after a little bit of headscratching. I actually made a nub mistake with the order of my includes which held me up a bit. going from Java to C++ is funny sometimes.

Anyway got started with some terrain and an animated .b3d character. Working pretty well so far. the Demo tutorial has been pretty useful.

So now I just need to make a proper third-person camera and whatnot, and I should be good to go. This is for an animation/programming class, so I don't really need a huge level. I just want my Gundam model to be able to knock little cars around or shoot them or something.