help me make game

kevin3000 · Post by **kevin3000** » Thu Apr 15, 2004 11:10 pm

hello

first i must say i am new to irrlicht so this must not be new question i did not find in search.

i want to make game with irrlicht and don't know how to calculate all the pictures i need them to look good in the game.
i understand that i have a scene and then i make pictures from screen
but i need many pictures from different scene.
can i use irrlicht to make fast game like this.
i do

draw scene
take screen picture
draw new scene
take new picture
draw new new scene
take new new picture

it long time goes to have all pictures for game. is irrlicht ok for this

thank you very much

kevin3000

Robomaniac · Post by **Robomaniac** » Thu Apr 15, 2004 11:13 pm

Are you talking about cutscenes, or your game itself. If the first I have no idea. If the second, that is not how you do it. Take a look at the tutorials, work through them, look at the api, read up on game programming, and then decide whether its right for you.

sorry for being a bit harsh if i came off that way

3dsmin · Post by **3dsmin** » Thu Apr 15, 2004 11:27 pm

What

sounds like you want to prerender all the scenes in your game.

you must be kidding kevin3000

Domarius · Post by **Domarius** » Mon Apr 19, 2004 2:34 am

If you're talking about a game like Myst, where you 'move around' in the game world by clicking 'forward', 'turn left' etc, and and presented with a new picture that represents your current orientation and position, then yes, but you could do this type of game much easier in Director or Flash or some other Multimedia development app. With pre-rendered pics from a 3D app like 3D studio or Maya.

Otherwise, I'm not sure what you're talking about.

HohesC · Post by **HohesC** » Tue Apr 20, 2004 4:56 pm

Hi Kevin3000

First of all i must congratulate you, for that briliant idea.

I think unreal has such a nice picture quality and fast frame rates because they do exactly what you propose.

Of course it takes a lot of work for rendering all possible situations but sadly thats the only possibilty for doing games after all.

Some poeple will tell you that games havily use vector calculations for computing every single step on the fly. They are wrong! The truth is that real engines use very strong compression algorithms to store every possible situation prerendered.

My suggestion is that you use jpg or png to store all your visual data.

I hope this encourages you to keep following your way.

Yours faithfully

HohesC

Granini · Post by **Granini** » Tue Apr 20, 2004 5:20 pm

I do not quite agree with the way ROBOMANIAC uses to answer to questions of qualified game programmers. Obviously Kevin3000 already worked through the tutorials and stuff. Otherwise Kevin3000 would'nt have put that question into this forum.

I would like to agree with HohesC - but I would like to suggest to chose the TIFF or Targa picture format since they blow up the amount of memory used. This will qualify your game as one of the big ones!

Keep up the good work!

All the best, keep it growing!
Granini

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Wed Apr 21, 2004 7:50 am

Hi!
I tried the same with a small game. I decided for the bitmap-format, because of the famous quality.
It looked very good!

Tequilla · Post by **Tequilla** » Wed Apr 21, 2004 7:53 am

Oups, the last guest was me.. I wasn't locked in

I wanted to edit my message:
I made a fps-shooter by that method. Because I used the bitmap-format my game looked much better then UT2004!

Tyn · Post by **Tyn** » Wed Apr 21, 2004 9:14 am

@Granini, Look around the beginners forums, at the questions asked and then make that comment again. You assume the guy is not a 12 year old learning a language, I'm not saying he is but this is the internet and you cannot tell the intelligence level you are speaking to. You say obviously he has worked through the tutorials but many people post without looking at the tutorials or API ( I've been just as guilty of that myself a few times ). All I am saying is forgive people for talking down sometimes, it's just a misjudgement of the intelligence level which is very easy to do.

@HohesC, which parts of Unreal are you claiming is pre-rendered? Loading big images can be slower than models with 128x128 textures sometimes. I can only imagine the skybox is pre-rendered but what is special about that? It works in Myst because nothing is really happening apart from those images being displayed, no frame by frame updates are happening so the overheads are very low. I can tell you exactly how many models are in a scene in Unreal because you can make your own levels, how can they pre-render a scene which hasn't been made? Use of billboards for stuff like grass I saw but no pre-rendered scenes.

Granini wrote:I do not quite agree with the way ROBOMANIAC uses to answer to questions of qualified game programmers. Obviously Kevin3000 already worked through the tutorials and stuff. Otherwise Kevin3000 would'nt have put that question into this forum.

I would like to agree with HohesC - but I would like to suggest to chose the TIFF or Targa picture format since they blow up the amount of memory used. This will qualify your game as one of the big ones!

Keep up the good work!

All the best, keep it growing!
Granini

Hiorlow · Post by **Hiorlow** » Wed Apr 21, 2004 12:50 pm

Hi Tyn,

You are absolutely right, but I'd consider taking a step to the left because you seem to be standing on your humor.

presendering rules

cheerio

Hiorlow

Robomaniac · Post by **Robomaniac** » Wed Apr 21, 2004 12:59 pm

Thank you Tyn, I was just about to post something like that.

<rant>
Unreal and all other action games (really all except adventure games) are not prerendered at all. The process to make what goes on the screen is similar but not at all like you made it out to be. Its goes something more like this.

Update World
Draw World into Back Buffer (don't display)
Flip Back Buffer to the Front
Erase Back (now the old Front Buffer) Buffer
Rinse
Repeat

There are no pictures saved, and no pictures (other than textures) loaded. It is all done in real time. The way that all leading games get their good fps etc. is optimisation, and other programming practices.

If your doing a myst like game though, this is fine

</Rant>

Granini · Post by **Granini** » Wed Apr 21, 2004 1:23 pm

here we go!
Kevin3000, you see.... they will tell you're wrong! Don't believe them! You are on the right way.

In fact your method is really clever

@Tyn: talking about intelligence level..... hum.... what can I say.....

Please define intelligence.......
My definition of intelligence: the ability to achieve the most with the given amount of knowledge. So therefore Kevin3000 has to be considered very intelligent.....
Wise people do not provide the right answers, they ask the right questions!

Prerendering rules

Granini

HohesC · Post by **HohesC** » Wed Apr 21, 2004 1:27 pm

Hi,

Prerendering will become one of the new key technologies of the 21-century when memory is no limiting factor anymore.

Take the tree rendering lib SpeedTreeFX for example, they do a lot of prerendering, like render trees to impostors.

If we think this a little bit further then prerendering all to images is very natural.

best wishes

HohesC

Tyn · Post by **Tyn** » Wed Apr 21, 2004 1:40 pm

I never said anyone was stupid here, just don't criticise a guy trying to help, in this case being Robo. You have to understand that I can't tell how much you know from a couple of lines, what you have and haven't done, whether you have bothered to look through other threads etc. There's a debate at the mo about doing some forum rules and that for that exact reason.

For the record I never said anyone here was stupid, never commented on Kev's intelligence nor said his method was wrong. Just not to take it personally if someone asks some basic questions like whether you have read the tutorials. Noone wants stupid arguements so I'll just leave it there.

@Hiorlow, lol, you wouldn't be the first to say that

BTW, my question about Unreal was genuine, I don't see what is pre-rendered about it, I would be interested to see if someone can show me a site about it or something.

Domarius · Post by **Domarius** » Wed Apr 21, 2004 2:27 pm

Granini, HohesC, I'm really confused by your claims that that a real-time 3D game like Unreal has anything at all to do with pre-rendering of any sort.

Could you elaborate?

The only thing I think you could be talking about is the BSP compilation process, which stores every possible 'leaf' in the tree that you can see, from every possible location. But that is a data structure used for choosing which polygons to render, nothing to do with displaying bitmaps...