ehm..Murphy, I'd recommend Mozilla FireFox 1.0..works like IE but how it should have been
Murphy's Irrlicht Mesh file format
oops...murphy posted while I was writting..I'l answer now...
ehm..Murphy, I'd recommend Mozilla FireFox 1.0..works like IE but how it should have been
ehm..Murphy, I'd recommend Mozilla FireFox 1.0..works like IE but how it should have been
Finally making games again!
http://www.konekogames.com
http://www.konekogames.com
[As I was saying, firefox never hangs(at least here), and 1.0 has way much more convenient extra functionality. Beside the great tabs...give it a try I'd recomend also their email software, also free, and seems a bit more safe than ...eeek...Outlook ]
SP2...ugh...
" vermeer, thanks a lot! I took a peek in the .x and the second set of UV coords seem to be stored pretty much exactly as I expected. I believe there are actually a number of ways for them to be stored legally, and without more research, I don't know how to write code that would work with all of them -- but for ones like in your file, it should be pretty easy. This is good news. "
Thanks to you, you are helping a lot to the engine and comunity providing this
happens that specially Ultimate Unwrap x export is one of the very few to load fine into Irrlicht with no need of the meshview step (which I have not tested if it kills the second UV, let us hope not...YIHAAA...mview does NOT kill it... respects the second UV..I think it's there since 8.1, but I thought mview was only 8.0 compliant...well..go guess....)
jedive reported me Ultimate x exported files loading directly with no probs in irrlicht, was the only one apart from mview...Though we did not test with 2 uv channels in it... erm...now that i think would not have been possible, is the point of all this, lol...
But even in case it would give probs to u, u could use mesh view...But it asked me to "validate mesh" for two offending triangles...this could be it's killing some important info...no, checked..is just fixing bad tris..i modelled too fast...
So, no prob there.
" What's holding me back now (I hadn't thought of this before) is the materials. Your .x file doesn't hold any references to the texture files (including the lightmap). This isn't a problem with your map since there's only the one texture and one lightmap (as you said, it'd be easy to do in code), but in order to write a converter that would work reasonably for more complex maps, it'd really need to be able to convert the texture references too. I think I know how to do that for materials with ONE texture, but not for materials with two textures (the lightmap). So... if you could find a way to have the .x reference the materials, that'd be great. It would help if there were more than one texture and more than one lightmap -- that should give"
I assume then you can already do it easily for just one texture, and one lightmap? as I know is already in the basic needs of every irrlitcher...if u get that one, you solve a load of problems... max Panda exporter allows exporting with linked material, multiple UVs, and all..but I don't have the max trial anymore..is 30 days only. hehe, could text the 7, lke did with the previous, but my 56k modem get's killed with the huge discreet provided trial...
BTW, I'm mor einterested in alowing cheap tools like UU...
Seems UU has no way to do this linking in exported x file...I try to see if I find an extra tool or something... or a workflow. Seems lately workflows pop up in front of me without asking....
I don't know if ASE actually export the linked texture from uu... Is better format, but I see a royal issue with standarized format...x is in every package, while ASE is almost exclusive of Max...
I know of K3d exporting ASE, I yet to dig deeply in that one. If it supports X as I think, it also would allow me the relinking... or if it does well the 2uv channels thing...K3d is multi OS, and open source, free for all. But I am not to optimistic bout it. The 2 uv channels is not often in tools, like weights is something they(3d modeller makers) understood a bit late is too needed for games.
I'll dig about all this stuff now and will tell you.
But in the meantime, trust me...99% of irlicht (and to an extent, many other indies) will already love a single texture, and single lightmap. Take in consideration we're only speaking about porting the lightmap , 2 uvs and difusse texture...I had thought multitexturing could be done later on internally, even not so dependant on x or whatever, but just adding extra texturing layers in teh engine and linking the other textures...
Dunno if I am saying unaccurate things, as I am not a programmer....
I mean, if the x with 2 uv channels, is easily there, I'd say, no doubt, it would be pretty useful. Also in the meantime I'm gonna do more research about it and tools available (sadly no more than one UV in blender) and possible workflows.
" me the info I need. It doesn't need to be pretty AT ALL. My thoughts are "
yep, but the artist suffer when ouputs even an uglys sample, hehe.
"that you could do something like:
Create a copy of the map and rotate it and hook it to the other one in a simple way to make the map twice as big. Move the lights around a bit in the copy. The lightmap that gile[s] had generated is almost full, so hopefully this will make it create a second lightmap image (or maybe you can tell it what size you want them to be, and thus force it to use multiple images?). Then just do some simple texture assignments (i.e. set the columns to be different textures)."
I am afraid the problem is..UU does not export the linked material, no matter in base material, or 2nd uv lightmap..so it's the same, the x format wont link it... So, i guess with x and UU we could only use one texture and one lightmap (enough for me for any shareware 3d game, for example, and many other more featued games...)
I don't understand very well your suggestion..u mean making space in UV space and reorganize UVs so to fit both lightmap uvs and texture uvs in same uv channel? that would bring problems of matching accuracy in lightmap...some very serious ones, as lightmaps usually are pixel precssion, as often are just 256x1256,,,,I think q3 where much smaller...
If u speak bout making sveral materials, and export all in uv channel 1...so that one is the texture, other is the lightmap...Can u really make it use only the texture one for channel 1 and the other for 2, if they're both in channel1?
even so, no deal...x texture link wont get exported in UU... but it does, and with several materials, in Blender. Indeed, this would be a way in Blender... as Blender can do a bake of lighting in the shape of radiosity info -vertex colors, must subdivide crazily the mesh, I suppose then bake to texture, link to original low res mesh, and export as X.
Hmm...but mor euniversal, more powerful more problems free..if You have so much ability in code as I am starting to guess...How hard would it be to have this different method :
I give you two plain OBJs. With their standard UV channel 1, the texture linked to it (all programs support it, OBJ is the king in standarizations and problems free one..is "everywhere") .I give u another with lightmap linked to uv channel 1, also. You pcik the uvs+texture of first for channel one in MIM format, and uvs+lightmaps of second obj file, for second MIM uv channel...
advantages:
-Even more standard.
-Kickass OBJ groups (Wings for example allows yhard edges workflow, also milkshape, max, and any.Except blender.)
-No triangle limit like in x 8.0 (not present the limit in 8.1) (anyway, this all depends on the 32 bit buffer or so mething called so, in irrlicht)
-thousands times easier format for u to parse.
-ANY package out there can output a texture linked to one UV channel. Open for every one, then, every platform... Is the converter the one which is making the "material" pile of one texture in base, one as lightmap, and for those making for example nature terrains, it comes handy to have more textures. For fps, u can live without it Only that when wanting to kill boring ness of a tiling wall, multitexturing gets really handy...we did so just using alpha mapped quads, very close to the wals surface so they didn't project shadows, but not so much as they'd do clipping errors.
disadvantages...you have to build the thing, then..I don't know , it sounds imposible...and the issue we're speaking here is...you say yo have it easy for adding th elink internally to one texture and one lightmap, but not so easy for mor multitexturing..I suppose u don't see a good workflow adding more OBJ's to the conversion for multiples uv textures...the artist knows how transparent must be the material, or how twaked...is a matter on how to carry it to you th efiles, more than anything...
"I'd try to do this myself, but, of course, don't have the tools."
I have forgotten x did not exported texture links...remembered yesterday, but though the linking inside irrliht would have been easy...argh
"The other thing holding me back is that I have so little experience with DirectX that it'll take me a while to figure out the best way to read the file, but it shouldn't be too hard."
Well, think about the multiple OBJs, each with a bitmap to its only channel1...I think if it were possible to add, would be such a universal solution. there would only be a need to bake shadows to channel 1 by the artist, and most tools allow this. Even Blender have some form of this. (While I am saying all this, I know blender will end up having a full fledged lightmapping feature some day...but now they're updating animation, luckily)
The other thing I think of is... ASE...but heck...no free tool outputting it, only the cheap uu... At least deled outputs an x, and a tiny lightmap...
Let me try though the K3d way, and I will see what can be done..I'll dig inet fo rother tools, but I found nothing before...who knows...
Just tell me ur thoughts on all this...
"In other news... afecelis, a CShop to MIM converter or a CShop loader shouldn't be too hard, but... I need a couple samples. Help me out here."
Now that I think...heh, I have just proposed the Db pro way...Indeed, this idea I had it since months ago read about how they do lightmaps (to overcome an engine limit) ...But I'd say never do the twice loading of same mesh...man , that's crazy...imagine a terrain, or just an fps level..u'd be duplicating mesh count for just adding a tga lightmap!! crazy...
Instead, my idea is bake the two UVs, each with a bit map attached (texture tga and lightmap tga) into one only multiUv file, importing the texture and lightmap links.... is this possible?
I'd recomend also their email software, also free, and seems a bit more safe than ...eeek...Outlook ]SP2...ugh...
" vermeer, thanks a lot! I took a peek in the .x and the second set of UV coords seem to be stored pretty much exactly as I expected. I believe there are actually a number of ways for them to be stored legally, and without more research, I don't know how to write code that would work with all of them -- but for ones like in your file, it should be pretty easy. This is good news. "
Thanks to you, you are helping a lot to the engine and comunity providing this
happens that specially Ultimate Unwrap x export is one of the very few to load fine into Irrlicht with no need of the meshview step (which I have not tested if it kills the second UV, let us hope not...YIHAAA...mview does NOT kill it... respects the second UV..I think it's there since 8.1, but I thought mview was only 8.0 compliant...well..go guess....)
jedive reported me Ultimate x exported files loading directly with no probs in irrlicht, was the only one apart from mview...Though we did not test with 2 uv channels in it... erm...now that i think would not have been possible, is the point of all this, lol...
But even in case it would give probs to u, u could use mesh view...But it asked me to "validate mesh" for two offending triangles...this could be it's killing some important info...no, checked..is just fixing bad tris..i modelled too fast...
So, no prob there.
" What's holding me back now (I hadn't thought of this before) is the materials. Your .x file doesn't hold any references to the texture files (including the lightmap). This isn't a problem with your map since there's only the one texture and one lightmap (as you said, it'd be easy to do in code), but in order to write a converter that would work reasonably for more complex maps, it'd really need to be able to convert the texture references too. I think I know how to do that for materials with ONE texture, but not for materials with two textures (the lightmap). So... if you could find a way to have the .x reference the materials, that'd be great. It would help if there were more than one texture and more than one lightmap -- that should give"
I assume then you can already do it easily for just one texture, and one lightmap? as I know is already in the basic needs of every irrlitcher...if u get that one, you solve a load of problems... max Panda exporter allows exporting with linked material, multiple UVs, and all..but I don't have the max trial anymore..is 30 days only. hehe, could text the 7, lke did with the previous, but my 56k modem get's killed with the huge discreet provided trial...
BTW, I'm mor einterested in alowing cheap tools like UU...
Seems UU has no way to do this linking in exported x file...I try to see if I find an extra tool or something... or a workflow. Seems lately workflows pop up in front of me without asking....
I don't know if ASE actually export the linked texture from uu... Is better format, but I see a royal issue with standarized format...x is in every package, while ASE is almost exclusive of Max...
I know of K3d exporting ASE, I yet to dig deeply in that one. If it supports X as I think, it also would allow me the relinking... or if it does well the 2uv channels thing...K3d is multi OS, and open source, free for all. But I am not to optimistic bout it. The 2 uv channels is not often in tools, like weights is something they(3d modeller makers) understood a bit late is too needed for games.
I'll dig about all this stuff now and will tell you.
But in the meantime, trust me...99% of irlicht (and to an extent, many other indies) will already love a single texture, and single lightmap. Take in consideration we're only speaking about porting the lightmap , 2 uvs and difusse texture...I had thought multitexturing could be done later on internally, even not so dependant on x or whatever, but just adding extra texturing layers in teh engine and linking the other textures...
Dunno if I am saying unaccurate things, as I am not a programmer....
I mean, if the x with 2 uv channels, is easily there, I'd say, no doubt, it would be pretty useful. Also in the meantime I'm gonna do more research about it and tools available (sadly no more than one UV in blender) and possible workflows.
" me the info I need. It doesn't need to be pretty AT ALL. My thoughts are "
yep, but the artist suffer when ouputs even an uglys sample, hehe.
"that you could do something like:
Create a copy of the map and rotate it and hook it to the other one in a simple way to make the map twice as big. Move the lights around a bit in the copy. The lightmap that gile[s] had generated is almost full, so hopefully this will make it create a second lightmap image (or maybe you can tell it what size you want them to be, and thus force it to use multiple images?). Then just do some simple texture assignments (i.e. set the columns to be different textures)."
I am afraid the problem is..UU does not export the linked material, no matter in base material, or 2nd uv lightmap..so it's the same, the x format wont link it... So, i guess with x and UU we could only use one texture and one lightmap (enough for me for any shareware 3d game, for example, and many other more featued games...)
I don't understand very well your suggestion..u mean making space in UV space and reorganize UVs so to fit both lightmap uvs and texture uvs in same uv channel? that would bring problems of matching accuracy in lightmap...some very serious ones, as lightmaps usually are pixel precssion, as often are just 256x1256,,,,I think q3 where much smaller...
If u speak bout making sveral materials, and export all in uv channel 1...so that one is the texture, other is the lightmap...Can u really make it use only the texture one for channel 1 and the other for 2, if they're both in channel1?
even so, no deal...x texture link wont get exported in UU... but it does, and with several materials, in Blender. Indeed, this would be a way in Blender... as Blender can do a bake of lighting in the shape of radiosity info -vertex colors, must subdivide crazily the mesh, I suppose then bake to texture, link to original low res mesh, and export as X.
Hmm...but mor euniversal, more powerful more problems free..if You have so much ability in code as I am starting to guess...How hard would it be to have this different method :
I give you two plain OBJs. With their standard UV channel 1, the texture linked to it (all programs support it, OBJ is the king in standarizations and problems free one..is "everywhere") .I give u another with lightmap linked to uv channel 1, also. You pcik the uvs+texture of first for channel one in MIM format, and uvs+lightmaps of second obj file, for second MIM uv channel...
advantages:
-Even more standard.
-Kickass OBJ groups (Wings for example allows yhard edges workflow, also milkshape, max, and any.Except blender.)
-No triangle limit like in x 8.0 (not present the limit in 8.1) (anyway, this all depends on the 32 bit buffer or so mething called so, in irrlicht)
-thousands times easier format for u to parse.
-ANY package out there can output a texture linked to one UV channel. Open for every one, then, every platform... Is the converter the one which is making the "material" pile of one texture in base, one as lightmap, and for those making for example nature terrains, it comes handy to have more textures. For fps, u can live without it Only that when wanting to kill boring ness of a tiling wall, multitexturing gets really handy...we did so just using alpha mapped quads, very close to the wals surface so they didn't project shadows, but not so much as they'd do clipping errors.
disadvantages...you have to build the thing, then..I don't know , it sounds imposible...and the issue we're speaking here is...you say yo have it easy for adding th elink internally to one texture and one lightmap, but not so easy for mor multitexturing..I suppose u don't see a good workflow adding more OBJ's to the conversion for multiples uv textures...the artist knows how transparent must be the material, or how twaked...is a matter on how to carry it to you th efiles, more than anything...
"I'd try to do this myself, but, of course, don't have the tools."
I have forgotten x did not exported texture links...remembered yesterday, but though the linking inside irrliht would have been easy...argh
"The other thing holding me back is that I have so little experience with DirectX that it'll take me a while to figure out the best way to read the file, but it shouldn't be too hard."
Well, think about the multiple OBJs, each with a bitmap to its only channel1...I think if it were possible to add, would be such a universal solution. there would only be a need to bake shadows to channel 1 by the artist, and most tools allow this. Even Blender have some form of this. (While I am saying all this, I know blender will end up having a full fledged lightmapping feature some day...but now they're updating animation, luckily)
The other thing I think of is... ASE...but heck...no free tool outputting it, only the cheap uu... At least deled outputs an x, and a tiny lightmap...
Let me try though the K3d way, and I will see what can be done..I'll dig inet fo rother tools, but I found nothing before...who knows...
Just tell me ur thoughts on all this...
"In other news... afecelis, a CShop to MIM converter or a CShop loader shouldn't be too hard, but... I need a couple samples. Help me out here."
Now that I think...heh, I have just proposed the Db pro way...Indeed, this idea I had it since months ago read about how they do lightmaps (to overcome an engine limit) ...But I'd say never do the twice loading of same mesh...man , that's crazy...imagine a terrain, or just an fps level..u'd be duplicating mesh count for just adding a tga lightmap!! crazy...
Instead, my idea is bake the two UVs, each with a bit map attached (texture tga and lightmap tga) into one only multiUv file, importing the texture and lightmap links.... is this possible?
Finally making games again!
http://www.konekogames.com
http://www.konekogames.com
Whoa! vermeer, another telegram!!! hehehehe I'll read it when I get back from work so that I can enjoy every exquisite details of it
@Murphy: sure! The CSM exporter to MIM sounds interesting. You already wrote a loader for Irrlicht? Would it load lightmaps as well? Did you already download the demo to try it out? Let me know what you need so that I can help you. If it's a level with some lights ,etc, just let me know if you need anything in particular.
happy day guys!
@Murphy: sure! The CSM exporter to MIM sounds interesting. You already wrote a loader for Irrlicht? Would it load lightmaps as well? Did you already download the demo to try it out? Let me know what you need so that I can help you. If it's a level with some lights ,etc, just let me know if you need anything in particular.
happy day guys!
IMHO, the best way to convert from most formats to MIM would be to write a loader from the format to irrlicht. Then we simply need an irrlicht function that can write an IMesh to MIM format. Of course, having a single internal mesh format would help, but I think the guys at NX are workign on that.
Once someone writes the function to save an irrlicht internalmesh to MIM format we immediately have a way to convert every format irrlicht can load to MIM. This may nto be practical to implement until irrlicht has a single internal mesh format though.
Once someone writes the function to save an irrlicht internalmesh to MIM format we immediately have a way to convert every format irrlicht can load to MIM. This may nto be practical to implement until irrlicht has a single internal mesh format though.
You do a lot of programming? Really? I try to get some in, but the debugging keeps me pretty busy.
Crucible of Stars
Crucible of Stars
-
RabidLockerGnom
LOVE the idea! I was thinking of making a SMIL loader for intro presentations and the such...hehehehe.....but nah, thats okay haha....
anyways, MIM looks awesome!
here's some requests though...for the future....i would LOVEto be able to call animations on certain parts of the mesh (doors etc..), or basically just be able to work with actual pieces of the model rather than the whole darn mesh...lol
Player1->RipApartBody();........[/i]
anyways, MIM looks awesome!
here's some requests though...for the future....i would LOVEto be able to call animations on certain parts of the mesh (doors etc..), or basically just be able to work with actual pieces of the model rather than the whole darn mesh...lol
Player1->RipApartBody();........[/i]
usually this is done accessing a bone, unless what you want is bring the model to pieces...poor model...
Or maybe you speak more about destructable scenery...or something.
Anyway, was looking intensely for ASE plugins, utilities, converters...man are they few... X is way much more spread, I am afraid.
I found there are a pair of ASE exporters for Blender but that is totally unuseful, as we have that functionality already with lots of formats (I allways mean:an ideal format to make a converter towards MIM) like great OBJ.
I found an ASE viewer at sourceforge, but didn't display the meshes....Found pretty polygon moedeller -is called so- for win, which allowed me to load the ase mesh, with some errrors, but didn't find my way with that app...and that's strange, as I usually do in first minutes... K3d did not seem to have any module to handle 2 UV channels, and anyway , does not load any format that is able to port two UVs, and I don't trust these aplications to generate the UVs... Yet though, I may dig a bit more on K3d, in case has some reasonable Uv making...as exports an ASE and works inlinux too.But if no second uv channel, no way.
So..apart from wonderful windows app Ultimate Unwrap, and of course, the package for which ase is native, Max, did not find any other app for ASE...which is clearly a no-no....I am digging for at least have a free tool, for the biggest audience -so if Linux and mac get included, much better- exporting to whatever the format with 2 UVs, and ability t ogenerate them...trust me...is even harder to find than weights and bones solution for free with x export, which actually did not exist fo free till Blender arrived...
Well, I lie...there was one, 3d Canvas 3.32, exporting as X, and with yet the 3 types of bone weighting...later on the author removed those features from his free version..yet can be found in certain oldies vaults...
The fact is...There's REALLY few formats with two UVs...indeed, apart from ASE and x....hmmmmm........
Indeed...an ideal one could be...yep, B3D...the problem is...no Linux application exporting any form of it...at least there are several applications exporting ASE or X without multiple UVs.... And not many in Windows...basically , for free, it is just limited to b3D pipeline, and that's not really free, as 3DS max is reallt far from free...
While for statics and animation, there are a load of modelling tools for free exporting as X (deled, zmodeller, metasequoia le, several Linux apps, Blender, etc) And a load also of comercial ones. A pitty so few are doing the multiple UV handling...
Or maybe you speak more about destructable scenery...or something.
Anyway, was looking intensely for ASE plugins, utilities, converters...man are they few... X is way much more spread, I am afraid.
I found there are a pair of ASE exporters for Blender but that is totally unuseful, as we have that functionality already with lots of formats (I allways mean:an ideal format to make a converter towards MIM) like great OBJ.
I found an ASE viewer at sourceforge, but didn't display the meshes....Found pretty polygon moedeller -is called so- for win, which allowed me to load the ase mesh, with some errrors, but didn't find my way with that app...and that's strange, as I usually do in first minutes... K3d did not seem to have any module to handle 2 UV channels, and anyway , does not load any format that is able to port two UVs, and I don't trust these aplications to generate the UVs... Yet though, I may dig a bit more on K3d, in case has some reasonable Uv making...as exports an ASE and works inlinux too.But if no second uv channel, no way.
So..apart from wonderful windows app Ultimate Unwrap, and of course, the package for which ase is native, Max, did not find any other app for ASE...which is clearly a no-no....I am digging for at least have a free tool, for the biggest audience -so if Linux and mac get included, much better- exporting to whatever the format with 2 UVs, and ability t ogenerate them...trust me...is even harder to find than weights and bones solution for free with x export, which actually did not exist fo free till Blender arrived...
Well, I lie...there was one, 3d Canvas 3.32, exporting as X, and with yet the 3 types of bone weighting...later on the author removed those features from his free version..yet can be found in certain oldies vaults...
The fact is...There's REALLY few formats with two UVs...indeed, apart from ASE and x....hmmmmm........
Indeed...an ideal one could be...yep, B3D...the problem is...no Linux application exporting any form of it...at least there are several applications exporting ASE or X without multiple UVs.... And not many in Windows...basically , for free, it is just limited to b3D pipeline, and that's not really free, as 3DS max is reallt far from free...
While for statics and animation, there are a load of modelling tools for free exporting as X (deled, zmodeller, metasequoia le, several Linux apps, Blender, etc) And a load also of comercial ones. A pitty so few are doing the multiple UV handling...
Finally making games again!
http://www.konekogames.com
http://www.konekogames.com
Something I was searching for...was a Gmax output format, usually by maxscript listener in Gmax...so to output level info (I have a working one with oBJ, I use it with my comented mouse trick for exporting all at once, I did so with a 100,000 tris or the like, no probs...only some minutes scrolling , lol...) ...as I'd expect...YES...it has it 99 available channels...it's all max 4.2 based, but it was already there, did not remember... Tried now, and added several UVW modifiers, each using one channel...no probs.
Must one of the VERY few apps doing this.
Of course, Gmax does NOT render. You still should use an external APP to generate maybe previously, maybe before, depends on the other tool's workflow, the actual bitmap lightmap. For example: Giles, or the free ones like Slim Shady, Trancos's Lume Tools (both having the limitation on curved surfaces, I am afraid, for the normals problem) , Deled, Trancos Modiified FsRad, etc. The TGA, actually, u'd asign then in Gmax, or Ultimate Unwrap...till I find a free one doing this...A pitty Blender doesn't.
Gmax is free(also for comercial), remember that. Many people think wrongly it is not. You just have to not reverse engineer it...
Must one of the VERY few apps doing this.
Of course, Gmax does NOT render. You still should use an external APP to generate maybe previously, maybe before, depends on the other tool's workflow, the actual bitmap lightmap. For example: Giles, or the free ones like Slim Shady, Trancos's Lume Tools (both having the limitation on curved surfaces, I am afraid, for the normals problem) , Deled, Trancos Modiified FsRad, etc. The TGA, actually, u'd asign then in Gmax, or Ultimate Unwrap...till I find a free one doing this...A pitty Blender doesn't.
Gmax is free(also for comercial), remember that. Many people think wrongly it is not. You just have to not reverse engineer it...
Finally making games again!
http://www.konekogames.com
http://www.konekogames.com
Yihaaa!
How couldn't I think about this before...
Boboland back From Five maxsccript... using it in Gmax.... It exports EVERYTHING, including multiples UVs(up to the 99 that Gmax can do) , in the form, it seems, of multisubobject materials...
To say that Gmax has enough power to make easily and quick all the uvmappings....
It can export cameras, lights, helpers, splines...Imho it'd make a kickas game level editor...was designed for that, indeed, lol...
As I explained, the output u can use it comercially, (many gmax models have been sold at turboisquid, besides the response of discreet staff even when forums where at the oficial discret site...All that cause the eula was not very clear, initially) if u don't reverse engineer this..and I see no reverse engineering in using an script in his listener, nor in doing the mous trick to make it less tedious. (you can do it traditional way, is just more tiring!)
Simply, nothing out there so powerful (other than using a Max , of course.)
And as an editor, is freakingly friendly and powerful...splines, booleans, loads of power...who know sif in the future a BBF--->Mim format would be porting camera animations, and lights....
The workflow for this, then, would be generating the 2 UV channels in it (maybe I have to guess some way of copying and pasting UVs (there are some free maxscripts available...oh, no need, is internal in Gmax, I saw it now..)) ...so, ok, you just paste the UVs that Giles, Slimshady, or deled generated for lightmaps, in the slot 2 of Uvs, inside Gmax. Asign it as second uv texture. The MIM converter then, should port it so that the actual uv2 channel texture(the tga lightmap), is understood and loaded as lightmap.. (that is, in multiply mode or whatever...)
The only problem I am finding is...it gives an error of "make directory no available" , when I execute bobo's script... As if a command was in Max maxscript but not in gmax maxscript..yet though, I have heard that this maxscript worked nicely with Gmax also...
Somebody throw me a light, if there's any...this would kickass for level editing...In license terms, I'd love Blender had 2nd Uv channel(gmax has 99, allowing then also multitexturing..only thing is gmax wont specify which is the one for lightmap, I guess some conventions must be reached, like leave the second only for lightmap, or something...an special name...), but a while till that, and imho, Gmax is more powerful for level editing (sorry, blenderheads)
somebody expert with bbf and gmax...heeeelp....!
How couldn't I think about this before...
Boboland back From Five maxsccript... using it in Gmax.... It exports EVERYTHING, including multiples UVs(up to the 99 that Gmax can do) , in the form, it seems, of multisubobject materials...
To say that Gmax has enough power to make easily and quick all the uvmappings....
It can export cameras, lights, helpers, splines...Imho it'd make a kickas game level editor...was designed for that, indeed, lol...
As I explained, the output u can use it comercially, (many gmax models have been sold at turboisquid, besides the response of discreet staff even when forums where at the oficial discret site...All that cause the eula was not very clear, initially) if u don't reverse engineer this..and I see no reverse engineering in using an script in his listener, nor in doing the mous trick to make it less tedious. (you can do it traditional way, is just more tiring!
)Simply, nothing out there so powerful (other than using a Max , of course.)
And as an editor, is freakingly friendly and powerful...splines, booleans, loads of power...who know sif in the future a BBF--->Mim format would be porting camera animations, and lights....
The workflow for this, then, would be generating the 2 UV channels in it (maybe I have to guess some way of copying and pasting UVs (there are some free maxscripts available...oh, no need, is internal in Gmax, I saw it now..)) ...so, ok, you just paste the UVs that Giles, Slimshady, or deled generated for lightmaps, in the slot 2 of Uvs, inside Gmax. Asign it as second uv texture. The MIM converter then, should port it so that the actual uv2 channel texture(the tga lightmap), is understood and loaded as lightmap.. (that is, in multiply mode or whatever...)
The only problem I am finding is...it gives an error of "make directory no available" , when I execute bobo's script... As if a command was in Max maxscript but not in gmax maxscript..yet though, I have heard that this maxscript worked nicely with Gmax also...
Somebody throw me a light, if there's any...this would kickass for level editing...In license terms, I'd love Blender had 2nd Uv channel(gmax has 99, allowing then also multitexturing..only thing is gmax wont specify which is the one for lightmap, I guess some conventions must be reached, like leave the second only for lightmap, or something...an special name...), but a while till that, and imho, Gmax is more powerful for level editing (sorry, blenderheads)
somebody expert with bbf and gmax...heeeelp....!
Finally making games again!
http://www.konekogames.com
http://www.konekogames.com
oops, bobo's bff i/o script....
http://www.scriptspot.com/bobo/darkmoon/bff/
Some users here kow it deeply....
http://www.scriptspot.com/bobo/darkmoon/bff/
Some users here kow it deeply....
Finally making games again!
http://www.konekogames.com
http://www.konekogames.com
ARGH
Ok, no way.
Seems BFF is designed for to import INTO Gmax, no to export, actually..out of Gmax.
Still I have some hopes on :
- An script for b3d format
- a nwn script
- a torque script
-some others.
Those are all designed for games. I have some hope one can work ok, and be parsed as they use to output ascii files to convert to MIM format.
I'll keep u all updated.
By all means -and already been seing the neeed workflow of this tool in conjunction with any free lightmaper, like slimshady, lume tools, fsrad, deled. (I suppose the windows apps can be loaded in Linux Wine, been reported that often this works greatly)
The gmax way allows ...A LOT. Multiple UVs till crazy numbers, huge res models and sceneries, even do the animation there for those wanting to make everything in the same package.... a very strong snapping system and building system with mixing greatly splines and polygon operations, booleans, smooth groups, etc, etc, etc....It has a lot of what max 4.2 had for what it matters in game art making...so you can imagine.
So, and while this is actually not for my own interest, as I already do all stuff in Ultimate, Gile[s], wings and others, and quite comfortably, I'd be glad to provide this all for totally free...I have already seen in a site the very in depth experiences of an user installing Gmax in Linux: I'll put the link later on if I find a good script to export in some ascii format the level, so Murphy can consider making a converter to MIM.
And sorry if all this looks a bit messy, is just that...well, I didn't remember Ultimate did not export the x linked textures, neither thought it was a barrier for the stuff. :S (BTW...this happens only with the cheap alternative, not with the uber-expensive: Max6 is told to export greatly all textures linked , and thanks to fvf data in x file, export up to the 99 channels Max has...)
But we already count on an excellent Max exporter for irrlicht lightmaps: My3D. I'm only making this research for the ones only able to use free tools.
Ok, no way.
Seems BFF is designed for to import INTO Gmax, no to export, actually..out of Gmax.
Still I have some hopes on :
- An script for b3d format
- a nwn script
- a torque script
-some others.
Those are all designed for games. I have some hope one can work ok, and be parsed as they use to output ascii files to convert to MIM format.
I'll keep u all updated.
By all means -and already been seing the neeed workflow of this tool in conjunction with any free lightmaper, like slimshady, lume tools, fsrad, deled. (I suppose the windows apps can be loaded in Linux Wine, been reported that often this works greatly)
The gmax way allows ...A LOT. Multiple UVs till crazy numbers, huge res models and sceneries, even do the animation there for those wanting to make everything in the same package.... a very strong snapping system and building system with mixing greatly splines and polygon operations, booleans, smooth groups, etc, etc, etc....It has a lot of what max 4.2 had for what it matters in game art making...so you can imagine.
So, and while this is actually not for my own interest, as I already do all stuff in Ultimate, Gile[s], wings and others, and quite comfortably, I'd be glad to provide this all for totally free...I have already seen in a site the very in depth experiences of an user installing Gmax in Linux: I'll put the link later on if I find a good script to export in some ascii format the level, so Murphy can consider making a converter to MIM.
And sorry if all this looks a bit messy, is just that...well, I didn't remember Ultimate did not export the x linked textures, neither thought it was a barrier for the stuff. :S (BTW...this happens only with the cheap alternative, not with the uber-expensive: Max6 is told to export greatly all textures linked , and thanks to fvf data in x file, export up to the 99 channels Max has...)
But we already count on an excellent Max exporter for irrlicht lightmaps: My3D. I'm only making this research for the ones only able to use free tools.
Finally making games again!
http://www.konekogames.com
http://www.konekogames.com
hmmm....yafray script for gmax...How didn't thought before....
I have found a compiled one -so, faster- that supports multi materials... great, as we need to make in gmax thes type, so to add a texture and uv channel per each....
I'll test later on and report here...mainly I'll dig on what I can read on the xml file output, is seen quickly in these text files which info is sent and which not..I hope it'd be enough anyway to build a converter...
I have found a compiled one -so, faster- that supports multi materials... great, as we need to make in gmax thes type, so to add a texture and uv channel per each....
I'll test later on and report here...mainly I'll dig on what I can read on the xml file output, is seen quickly in these text files which info is sent and which not..I hope it'd be enough anyway to build a converter...
Finally making games again!
http://www.konekogames.com
http://www.konekogames.com
HEY!
this yafray XML exporter ROCKS seriously!
It's very clear, and seems export nicely materials and its settings..multimaterials or how its called, are supported....I may later on output an sceen of mine with several materials in a multi material, each haing a texture asigne to a different uv channel..only one doubt: that this is actually outputting the actual UV coords per each....
It says it "supports UV mapping" but that's could mean not fully, so I don't know, yet.
I have already seen in the ascii output xml, it says material 4, material 5...and ...multiple UV, etc...was a very large scene (but used my mous trick, hehe, only some seconds to scroll it and paste to notepad....ye good old trick...no extra tool needed, lol...)
I'll try to output a very basic scene, so I can post directly here. With two uv materials, etc.
So in case Murphy is kind to see if he coul duse that to convert to MIM.
I have seen things like this :
<modulator texname="Map #4" mode="mul" texco="uv" clipping="repeat" >
or....
<shader type="generic" name="Mtl #4" >
<attributes>
<color r="0.588" g="0.588" b="0.588" />
<specular r="0.9" g="0.9" b="0.9" />
<transmitted r="0" g="0" b="0" />
<hard value="10.0" />
<IOR value="1" />
</attributes>
</shader>
<texture type="image" name="Map #4" >
<filename value="D:\not interesting path for you\x_file2.png" />
</texture>
AND...
<shader type="generic" name="Mtl #5" >
<attributes>
<color r="0.588" g="0.588" b="0.588" />
<specular r="0.9" g="0.9" b="0.9" />
<transmitted r="0" g="0" b="0" />
<hard value="10.0" />
<IOR value="1" />
</attributes>
<modulator texname="Map #4" mode="mul" texco="uv" clipping="repeat" >
<color value="1.0" />
</modulator>
</shader>
yummy...smoothing info.... <mesh autosmooth="45" >
exactly the value I did set in gmax...
<object name="staticMesh" shader_name="Mtl #4" shadow="on" >
<attributes> </attributes>
<mesh autosmooth="45" >
<points>
<p x="-0.87992" y="-3.70633" z="-0.24857" />
<p x="-1.50492" y="-3.83582" z="-0.3007" />
....
let me guess...those above are the raw vertices....simple as that...
<faces>
<f a="0" b="1" c="2"
u_a="0.056919" v_a="0.171136" u_b="0.076889" v_b="0.074748" u_c="0.076889" v_c="0.190706" shader_name="Mtl #4" />
hummm...let me guess.
u_a , v_a are u and v coords of each vertex... ("UV" )
so, there appear each 3 vertices of each triangle (face) , in pairs (U, and Uv , UV coords...)
....
hum...I should have been smarter and do an scene with two actual , or 3 uv materials...as the other one was a parametric checker, not an uv texture...silly me.
I'll do a better sample to hang here.
I'm started to get convinced...This is the way to go!!
even camera is exported...we don't need it now, but would be a great ui to output camera navigation to the engine, later on...
<camera name="Camera01" resx="640" resy="480" focal="1.20711" use_qmc="yes" >
<from x="-0.0933943" y="-31.7082" z="15.0867" />
<to x="1.49561" y="6.89069" z="0.0001" />
<up x="-0.0784315" y="-31.3447" z="16.0182" />
</camera>
And well...
Gmax is soooooo sweet. I ahve used too much time with more spartan freebies.... LOL.
yum....
of course, it's by no means a need to translate every little value there...just basic smoothing info, uvs, textures, vertices.
oops...site url...
http://www.geocities.com/kam_b_lai/
Please, Murphy, tell me there's not huge problems with this...
It could be great...
I'll output later on a complete but *really* low poly scene. Just with all features needed (UVs, textures, smoothing)
Regards,
this yafray XML exporter ROCKS seriously!
It's very clear, and seems export nicely materials and its settings..multimaterials or how its called, are supported....I may later on output an sceen of mine with several materials in a multi material, each haing a texture asigne to a different uv channel..only one doubt: that this is actually outputting the actual UV coords per each....
It says it "supports UV mapping" but that's could mean not fully, so I don't know, yet.
I have already seen in the ascii output xml, it says material 4, material 5...and ...multiple UV, etc...was a very large scene (but used my mous trick, hehe, only some seconds to scroll it and paste to notepad....ye good old trick...no extra tool needed, lol...)
I'll try to output a very basic scene, so I can post directly here. With two uv materials, etc.
So in case Murphy is kind to see if he coul duse that to convert to MIM.
I have seen things like this :
<modulator texname="Map #4" mode="mul" texco="uv" clipping="repeat" >
or....
<shader type="generic" name="Mtl #4" >
<attributes>
<color r="0.588" g="0.588" b="0.588" />
<specular r="0.9" g="0.9" b="0.9" />
<transmitted r="0" g="0" b="0" />
<hard value="10.0" />
<IOR value="1" />
</attributes>
</shader>
<texture type="image" name="Map #4" >
<filename value="D:\not interesting path for you\x_file2.png" />
</texture>
AND...
<shader type="generic" name="Mtl #5" >
<attributes>
<color r="0.588" g="0.588" b="0.588" />
<specular r="0.9" g="0.9" b="0.9" />
<transmitted r="0" g="0" b="0" />
<hard value="10.0" />
<IOR value="1" />
</attributes>
<modulator texname="Map #4" mode="mul" texco="uv" clipping="repeat" >
<color value="1.0" />
</modulator>
</shader>
yummy...smoothing info.... <mesh autosmooth="45" >
exactly the value I did set in gmax...
<object name="staticMesh" shader_name="Mtl #4" shadow="on" >
<attributes> </attributes>
<mesh autosmooth="45" >
<points>
<p x="-0.87992" y="-3.70633" z="-0.24857" />
<p x="-1.50492" y="-3.83582" z="-0.3007" />
....
let me guess...those above are the raw vertices....simple as that...
<faces>
<f a="0" b="1" c="2"
u_a="0.056919" v_a="0.171136" u_b="0.076889" v_b="0.074748" u_c="0.076889" v_c="0.190706" shader_name="Mtl #4" />
hummm...let me guess.
u_a , v_a are u and v coords of each vertex... ("UV"
)so, there appear each 3 vertices of each triangle (face) , in pairs (U, and Uv , UV coords...)
....
hum...I should have been smarter and do an scene with two actual , or 3 uv materials...as the other one was a parametric checker, not an uv texture...silly me.
I'll do a better sample to hang here.
I'm started to get convinced...This is the way to go!!
even camera is exported...we don't need it now, but would be a great ui to output camera navigation to the engine, later on...
<camera name="Camera01" resx="640" resy="480" focal="1.20711" use_qmc="yes" >
<from x="-0.0933943" y="-31.7082" z="15.0867" />
<to x="1.49561" y="6.89069" z="0.0001" />
<up x="-0.0784315" y="-31.3447" z="16.0182" />
</camera>
And well...
Gmax is soooooo sweet. I ahve used too much time with more spartan freebies.... LOL.
yum....
of course, it's by no means a need to translate every little value there...just basic smoothing info, uvs, textures, vertices.
oops...site url...
http://www.geocities.com/kam_b_lai/
Please, Murphy, tell me there's not huge problems with this...
It could be great...
I'll output later on a complete but *really* low poly scene. Just with all features needed (UVs, textures, smoothing)
Regards,
Finally making games again!
http://www.konekogames.com
http://www.konekogames.com
digging in several forums about this thing....
"c) Only real UVW Mapping is supported. UV mapping that is assigned through the material editor isn't seen by the exporter. You'll need to ensure that your maps have real UV coordinates assigned and mapped using modifiers to render properly."
Ok, I had already done so mechanically, as it uses to like more the engines this way...
" YafRay uses a much smaller scale than gmax"
Not a problem, but in case someone gets a surprise
Seems that YaGmax is the most powerful, as there's another not supportin multi materials. So I did put u the right link.
A reference of the syntax is in docs in the zip file, and in th esite, I think, plus some help. But imho it is reaaally clear...heck, I can'tcode a word, and I understood it...
"c) Only real UVW Mapping is supported. UV mapping that is assigned through the material editor isn't seen by the exporter. You'll need to ensure that your maps have real UV coordinates assigned and mapped using modifiers to render properly."
Ok, I had already done so mechanically, as it uses to like more the engines this way...
" YafRay uses a much smaller scale than gmax"
Not a problem, but in case someone gets a surprise
Seems that YaGmax is the most powerful, as there's another not supportin multi materials. So I did put u the right link.
A reference of the syntax is in docs in the zip file, and in th esite, I think, plus some help. But imho it is reaaally clear...heck, I can'tcode a word, and I understood it...
Finally making games again!
http://www.konekogames.com
http://www.konekogames.com
Now, I suppose what you would need is...take the material with uv texture in first channel as base texture, and the one at two, as lightmap...and apply so in the engine, I suppose just do the conversion to MIM, where you actually apply those settings...and may take following materials as multitexturing, in a feathered, opacity, multiply mode or whatever, I'm lost in coding terms....
is it ok?
I told, later I'll hang here a clear and full simple scene for u to check.
is it ok?
I told, later I'll hang here a clear and full simple scene for u to check.
Finally making games again!
http://www.konekogames.com
http://www.konekogames.com