Elander & "Trolling" Reply

[Eternl Knight]

I thought I'd start a new thread to "clean up the poop" as elander put it. He has insisted on making his accusations public (after twice being invited to take them PM). I feel it is only fair for the reply to be made public too. If mods wish to lock / delete the thread - so be it, but please note that I am not actually insulting elander but "clearing the air" after he made accusations ignoring the requests of the mods and myself to take it private.

Sure just after cleaning up a bit of the poop EK is trying to make of the Irrlicht forums. This was the thread i was refereing to:

http://irrlicht.sourceforge.net/phpBB2/ ... 53&start=0

"And the development community (as opposed to the artist community) is quite elitist. Which is funny given the code quality (or lack thereof) in several places throughout the code-base. That is not to say that they haven't made some important innovations (SDNA is pretty cool), but I have seen many people suggest features / improvements only to be smacked down (hard) by the developers. "

"I was the guy that posted about their "elitist" atitude, and I stick by it. While they may "now" be implmenting features people have requested/suggested - when they are suggested unless you are ( a ) one of the developers or ( b ) the idea is an extension of their existing features - you will be trounced on. "

"Implementing features that Ton does not like (regardless of how useful or highly requested they are) will not make it into the main trunk. For example, Ton has stated that CAD/CAM like utilities will not be allowed. So one cannot make a box EXACTLY 10 units wide. This is easy to implement (and has been in several branches), but will not be integrated as it is against Ton's "artistiic philosophy". Which is fine, he controls the featureset and all, but it IS elitist. "

"For the record - it was not Joeri who blasted me (& others), it was Ton himself. "

Again you are trying to do the same thing with the irrlicht forums. If you have anything against any menber of the forums either use PM or make your own thread addressing the problem with the "evidence" you didn't provide and leave your personal whinny dramas out of it. You are not contributing with anything you are only giving an exagerated bad image of these forums that is far from the truth.

*laugh* If that's the best evidence you have of "trolling" - you're more desperate than I thought.

Ton has himself frequently criticised the code quality in sections of the Blender code-base. Don't believe me? Read the archives of the blender-developers mailing list (I happen to be on it). The code remains in that state until one of the volunteers fixes it or they replace the functionalityt with something different.

As for the example I gave - it's true. You seem to frequent the Blender development forums - you probably saw the example. And speaking of forums - don't you think that if I was trying to start a flamewar on the Blender forums (as you accused me of) - I would be posting over there? Funny how that didn't happen - as the messages where I disagreed with an approach or comment made Ton, Broken, etc was emailed to them personally. Somehow that behaviour speaks to me of being less "trollish" and more "considerate" in how I express my opinion.

So next time you want to accuse me of "trolling" perhaps you should (a) get the right board, (b) gather some evidence, and (c) take it up with a mod. Publically derailing a thread because my opinion on Blender differs from yours is quite rude.

[vermeer]

If the root of all evil here is around the matter of Blender being some kind of perfect god send, I clarify that: is not. As a perfect 3d package does not exist. Blender is *not* an exception in that, also hasn't got the load of coders full time present in comercial packages. That does not disminish the merit of some few coders doing real wonders for the low resources available. But to attack a problem is better to start from reality. Indeed, imho that is more near Ton's line, most probably. I remember I posted in that direction in that thread, also.

About the elitism matter, well, I there would disagree(while there's a use of a bit "superior" like response among an small minority of the Blender people.). Is not an elitist Ton if he decides a route, as well, is an open source software, but mainly he paid very expensive price with his life years for the tool, the way I see it, he has more than a right to go one or another direction if is his criteria, same as other old time coders. Even new ones that are there coding hard. We have less to say there. And as with irrlicht and any thing given free, as is, is a gift, a present. So who is to complain about a or b feature...

BTW, yeah, better solve that by PM.

[Guest]

More power to you EK. I know nothing about either of you other than what is in the thread that I had posted a lot it - and just from that I can see you have done nothing wrong and Elanders idea of "trolling" is way off base from real trolling.

I am sure most who read it realised that Elander was barking up the wrong tree and just ignored him. Even if there was more to it over in Blender forums, there was very little evidence (if any) in irrlicht ones so his post was out of place and obstructive to that threads discussion. That was the only "harm" and even that is a storm in a tea cup

[Eternl Knight]

I don't think that Blender is a bad package at all. I find it's interface nigh on unusable, but that is obviously personal preference as there are a tonne of people sayinig it's the most intuitive one they've used. Different strokes for different folks. As far as functionality is concerned - I'll be the first to admit that I LOVE the LSCM uv-mapping functionality.

I agree that there is simply not a perfect 3D application out there. At least, I do not have the money to go searching for it! Hell, I have trained on Maya and yet still use Wings as I find it's polygon editing tools far superior.

To clear the air about my conduct on the Blender forums - people still suspicious of me can check out every post I ever made on them here.

--EK

[Pr3t3nd3r]

Personally i think blender rullz ... (probably have lots of problems and an harder interface (not an commercial program) but also probably more powerful interface)

And trolls i don't think they exist ... i'm almost sure .
So i don't even understand why are fighting around ... + 4 Eternl Knight ... no one cares

ps. personal discutution between fighting people:
(fp1) You are a troll.
(fp2) No you are a troll
(fp1) No. You are a troll.
(fo2) No. You are a troll.
... after 500 PM
(fo2) No. You are a troll.
(fp1) No. You are a troll.
...after 500 more back to the forum
(fpx) fpx1 is an troll and don't want to admitted
fpx2 no!!! fpx1 is a troll. i know it.
... 500 more post on different topics
afecelis: Shut the gently caress up both of you or both of you will be banned.
(Xperson) (he hates trolls ... bad childhood) are you sure they don't make avertising for trols?
(Xpersonq) (he hates guests ... bad childhood ... scary guests ...) GUEST should be disable because he is an troll

[afecelis]

THE SUBTLE ART OF TROLLING
http://www.urban75.com/Mag/troll.html

[pr3t3nd3r_guest]

so trols realy exists

very cool informations ... is good you post'it here ... now will be more lool

[elander]

So next time you want to accuse me of "trolling" perhaps you should (a) get the right board, (b) gather some evidence, and (c) take it up with a mod. Publically derailing a thread because my opinion on Blender differs from yours is quite rude.

I don't care about your public problems with the Blender project leader or your post in here to diss Blender project leader in his back without providing any evidence. Neither i care with your personal problems with any member of this forum.

If you think the word trolling is not ellegant enough to your refined taste then lets say that dissing people in their backs is a bit rude and arrogant. I have informed myself in the Blender forums and it seams like you in fact started it all just because nobody was interesed in your sugestions and you reacted in an imature way against the entire forum. It's your atitude people criticised not your sugestions.

The one who has derailed the other thread in this forum was you by posting this and acusing "some personalities" of your made up "attack against innocent noobies" in this forums without providing any evidence of that. If you want to make any personal attacks at least have some balls and do it in their faces.

Actually, what I think puts people off of Irrlicht is not so much the whining (you get that with EVERY engine), but the few immature & arrogant members that tell people new to the forum to shut up, get lost, "do it yourself", etc.

You are going to get both the whingers & the newbies on EVERY engine out there. I believe that one of the best things about Irrlicht is the ease in which one can get an application up & running. However, this ease stops once you get to the forums. I have personally found that Niko is quite pleasant when he posts but nigh most of the "forum personalities" are either rude, arrogant, or both.

I like Irrlicht. I think it could become a very popular engine in open-source. However, were it not for the fact that I was using Irrlicht for a month and a half before reading the forums - I would have dropped it like a rock.

--EK

Firts of all who are these so called immature and arrogant personalities who attack innocent noobies in these forums. I would like to know them myself and the innocent noobies.

Second where is this attack against innocent noobies going on. I have searched for it everywhere and didn't find any.

So who is making a personal drama? These forums are as much friendly to nobies as the Blender forums or any other similar open source project with years of life. Nobody here is attacking innocent nobies but some bitches get what they deserve.

[Guest]

Firts of all who are these so called immature and arrogant personalities who attack innocent noobies in these forums. I would like to know them myself and the innocent noobies.

im sure that´d be me

[Guest]

lool afecelis that link is great time to bring on my trolling skills be prepared!!

[sRc]

lool afecelis that link is great time to bring on my trolling skills be prepared!!

lol its not supposed to be a perfection guide gfx

[Pr3t3nd3r]

When i was coming home from school i realized the values of trolls.

So. Officially all trolls are invited to my forum .
I give free beer an woman's
Feel free to join

[afecelis]

hehehhe, GFX, try not to use your new skills around here too much!

[vermeer]

the fact is...an scandinavian troll creature is much a more interesting thing than bored kids in the inet...


I was allways a bit upset for the choice of that name for it...

[elander]

Firts of all who are these so called immature and arrogant personalities who attack innocent noobies in these forums. I would like to know them myself and the innocent noobies.

im sure that´d be me

You just told some nobes to use Google. Maybe EK thinks this is a serious attack.

Strange then the noobe told you to shut the gently caress up. He must have lost his innocence there.